Will there ever be a AF vol. 4?

[PWalk]

Well we've had vol. 3 cancelled now. The last 2 volumes of AF have lasted a combined 32 issues. Somethings not working here.

While we all know and agree that AF could be a viable title if Marvel would just handle it differently I think its fair to argue that this maybe the final volume of AF we'll see. Lets face it the title just doesn't sell. It hasn't been taken seriously by "mainstream" comic readers since Byrne left volume 1. This is disappointing because I've always enjoyed this team. They're a great read and I know for a fact that if treated properly this title could bloom into a solid seller and critical success.

So now I ask you all, do you think we've seen the last of Alpha Flight as a monthly title?

[DelBubs]

I don't think it's the last we'll see of them in a monthly series, but it's the last time for quite a long while. If you say some comics just don't carry enough weight to make a monthly viable, then I would even settle for periodic 4/6 part limiteds and guest appearences in other titles. It's definately not the last we'll see of AF, but a new monthly is a long way off (IMHO)

[varo]

i think we will see a new monthly with the originals sooner rather than later, just because of some things that quesada has said, especially the "things are cyclitory" comment when asked about the return of the originals.


i hope so. this series has to much potential, i am sick of seeing it botched with gimmicks.

[MattSD]

I think we will see a return of AF in a couple years again...The team will show up in Wolverine or X-Men and get a positive response, and some known writer will want to take a shot at em....Characters like Cloak & Dagger/Moon Knight/Alpha Flight have potential, that is why they keep on getting their chances time and again

[mvranas]

The team will show up in Wolverine or X-Men and get a positive response, and some known writer will want to take a shot at em...
I agree. With recent examples like Hawkman & JSA, I believe Alpha still has the potential to be a solid seller.

-Mike.

[Barnacle13]

Alpha is definitely a viable seller as a monthly, but a lot of changes would be needed to make it a success. First, you gotta have at least a core team of original characters. One does not constitute a core! Mac (not the young clone from Vol2 either) or Heather has to be the leader. Puck has to be on the roster in some capacity. He is the heart of Alpha Flight afterall! Sas has to be on the roster, if for nothing more the visual effect of him next to Puck. After that I think you can mix and match again. I know this comment won't make me popular with a lot of folks here, but these are the key core characters in this book. Shaman, Snowbird, Northstar, Aurora, Box, etc. are all great characters, but are they essential from the "family feel" perspective? At least 2 other origianl members should be on the team. Snowbird and Shaman would be my picks, but I know a lot of others would rather the twins or Box or Marrina even. After that I figure you can feel a slot from each of the other two volumes. Flex or Ghost Girl from vol2 and MMJ from Vol3 would be my picks there. MMJ and Guardian could make for some great hero worship stories. My how MMJ would be disappointed when he found out Mac was just a man! I'd use the other characters throughout the series in guest and support roles. Now that I think about it, Talisman would probably be a better fit for the team with Shaman in support.

Then, you have to get a writer who will give the team a serious treatment. Get rid of the conspiracy of Department H, though I think a great starting point would be the story of how they break away. Eventually you'd have to build them into a team that is taken seriously by the Avengers, X-groups, etc. of the world. Even Power Pack got better treatment in the MU and they were a bunch of prepubescent kids with limited abilities.

A class A villain and cast of B class villains would have to be created or built on. Dream Queen, Great Beasts, the Master, etc. Thay have to be worthy of any team facing off against. Wouldn't it be cool to see Alpha called in by the Avengers because they know how to deal with one of the great beasts that has slipped across the border into Montana or something. Imagine Cap's shield swallowed by Tundra, Hawkeye a complete liability, Iron Man breaking off chunks but making now real progress. Then Alpha shows up and stops the Beast in its tracks.

Lastly, Marvel would have to promote the fact that they're doing things right this time with advertisements and subscription offers. Even go to deep discounts for the first year to hook readers in. Instaed of a $27 subscription rate, offer $18 or something. That'll get folks to at least look at it. Get a good writer and artist and you can bank the full subscription price for years to come.

I think it'll be a good long time before Marvel can get their head out of their rear and accomplish this though. So I won't be holding my breat for a quick return. Maybe by my 40th birthday! That's closer than you think!

Barnacle

[Scarlettspiderg]

I'm hoping for a V4 and I'm hoping its with us for AF 25th Anniversary (2007), the title should start out with all past Alpha's and a major threat (return of The Master? A Plodex Invasion?) and AF members past and present tackling the threat. Afterwards Heather decides that the world (well Canada at least) needs AF and so decides to lead the new team.

Sasquatch (happy to go back to being the scientist of the team) agrees to stay as do both Pucks (Puck II learns during the earlier threat that Puck is her father), Shaman stays and Nemesis hangs around (like Wolverine in his early X-Men appearances).

Northstar takes a break from the X-Men (don't know if he is officially an x-man) and asks the team for help tracking down his sister (who never showed during the threat), which leads into AF V4's 2nd story arc.

[Cliff]

I hate to say it, but Mac as leader is passé and having Heather as Vindicator is done to death already. I think they'd lead but from an administrative position trying to enjoy the downtime. Of course that wouldn't last, but I'd thing either of them would be hesitant to put on the suits at this point. Mac could appoint a new Guardian and refine the suit, but have it function a lot more like it originally did. It's a better protection, but not as powerful as it got later in Vol1 and Vol2.

Doing away with the DptH conspiracy nonsense is the best bet from a writing standpoint. Any organization that corrupt would have been disbanded or at least found out by the Canadian Govt and shut down.

I think the B-list baddies should be out of the pool of British villains typically ascociated with Captain Britain and the original Excalibur title. Gatecrasher and her group were great and there are tons of others.

I'd even say that Wolverine (yes...I said it) shoul dcome in as a veteran and stick with Alpha, reuniting his ties to his old friends Eugene and the Hudsons. Now, whether we like to admit it or not, that'd boost yer sales RIGHT up... (lol)

[Mokole]

I've said this lots by why not again?

- Hudsons as Heads of a smaller, more NGO Department H.
- E-M suits get trashed
- Judd as trainer for Alpha Flight, combat, strategy, weapon use
- Shaman as physician for AF
- Snowbird as liaison to the northern gods
- Sasquatch as part-time member, head of science studies
- Northstar an X-Men, liaison that way too
- Aurora getting psychiatric treatment, finally! No more superheroics
- Alpha Flight lead downtime by Puck, on duty by Sasquatch. Downtime he doesn't train with them
- Members are Ghost Girl, Zuzha Yu, Nemesis, Box (once his head gets straightened out), Feedback, Windshear, and maybe Diamond Lil or Talisman, but I'd prefer them in Omega Flight as enemies.

And I think Quesada will reboot AF in a year or less, money to be made. I'm going to e-mail him more about this! :D :?

[Le Messor]

I've always seen Shaman as the 'father figure' of the team, so he fits the family feel.

Shunting the whole original team off into administrative roles seems as pointless and self-destructive as getting rid of them.

As to the question? No, I don't think this'll be the last ever volume. When the next one will come out, I don't know, but I think there'll be one. Barring the apocalypse or whatever.

I only hope we'll see -Alpha Flight- in the next "Alpha Flight" series.

- Le Messor
"Sir, what should I do if I step on a mine?"
"The standard procedure is to leap several feet in the air and scatter yourself over a wide area."
- Blackadder

[Barnacle13]

I've said this lots by why not again?

- Members are Ghost Girl, Zuzha Yu, Nemesis, Box (once his head gets straightened out), Feedback, Windshear, and maybe Diamond Lil or Talisman, but I'd prefer them in Omega Flight as enemies.

?

I wouldn't buy it for long unles it were really well written. You have to have the originals in there somewhere on the field team if you want the old timers to stick around. After two failed attempts without them on the team, I think it's pretty obviousa third would fail. In fact this is largely what happened to Vol 1., too many B list heroes and no one iconic. I consider myself a die hard, but I'm starting to get awfully tired of watching Alpha Flight die because they don't use what has proven to work.

[tkmadison]

Doing away with the DptH conspiracy nonsense is the best bet from a writing standpoint. Any organization that corrupt would have been disbanded or at least found out by the Canadian Govt and shut down.

LOL
ooohooo
sorry...no disrespect. I'm no expert on the depths of the Dept. H conspiracy story arc, but just reading that the Canadian government would have found and shut down a very corrupt arm brought me to tears.

Like every government, Canada's is corrupt. Every few months there is some kind of scandal coming out.
I dunno, was Dept. H misappropriating funds? That'd be believable in a Canadian context...
...although we, too, have our history of corruption and shadowing doings...

[HappyCanuck]

I have to agree with TK: not only would the government prolly keep a foundation like Dept H open, but they would prolly allecute more funds for it, as well as provide any cover-story they'd need.

Sorry guys, but Canada isn't quite as idealic as you'd like to think. O'course, in my eyes, it's better than most of the alternatives...

[kozzi24]

PWalk wrote:
The last 2 volumes of AF have lasted a combined 32 issues. Somethings not working here.


Like not having ALPHA FLIGHT in the title?

I think you can forget about most Volume 2 characters for the most part. Unlike the originals, tyhey are proven non-sellers. You can't get too crowded with members from all of Alpha's phases, or you risk really alienating new readers.

I think there will be a Volume 4, and I think politics may have played into volume 3. Didn't Scott Lobdell say something to the effect that he had made 2 pitches to Marvel, on Alpha and one something else and he was told to combine them. Does anyone think it's possible that JQ recognized the potential of an Alpha Flight title, but after the brouhaha with Byrne over The Hidden Years that he wasn't to avoid using the Byrne characters? Maybe by the time he made his cyclical comment, the axe had already fallen and he recognized that the core readership wanted Byrne's AF characters in a book called Alpha Flight, eh?

[tkmadison]

Sorry guys, but Canada isn't quite as idealic as you'd like to think. O'course, in my eyes, it's better than most of the alternatives...

:D Absolutely correct on both points.
I would like to see massive numbers of people take to the streets on some of these issues (Vancouver is a funny example - you've got corruption in all levels of government, and the only thing people had taken to the streets and rioted over was a freakin' hockey game - the APEC summit, and "Riot at the Hyatt" don't really count...I was there for both and both were initiated by the police) - but North Americans seems far too apathetic.

[cmdrkoenig67]

I just sent two emails(and I'm working on a snail mail letter too)....one to Marvel and one to Joe Quesada. Both letters were very polite and offered my viewpoints on why this series and the last series failed to generate the sales needed to keep them ongoing(i.e. the fact that both vol 2 and 3, lacked the main elements that would keep long-time Af readers buying the series....Alpha Flight itself). I basically stated my personal opinions and backed up why I feel the way I do.

I asked for AF to be relaunched soon, with a premise more in touch with Volume one, indicating that AF has a rich history and a wealth of characters to use and explore. The original AF needs to return and new characters are welcome too, but to ignore the origins and original faces of this team is a big, big mistake(two failed series prove this). Some people may not see eye to eye with me on this, but I believe I am correct on this. I know a few AF fans here have had very similar, if not the very same feelings on why the series failed. I'm glad I'm not alone in my opinion.

I hope my letters will reach somebodys' eyes/mind(s)/heart(s) and they will relaunch the book the way it was meant to be.

Dana

[tkmadison]

I hope my letters will reach somebodys' eyes/mind(s)/heart(s) and they will relaunch the book the way it was meant to be.

Unfortunately, the problem with Marvel these days is that they are currently owned by a toy company. Marvel's resurrection from fiscal ruin was great at the time, but what this essentially means is that the only titles that are going to get dedicated attention are ones that you can make action figures from that tie into a movie that's been made.
Hence the popularity of Spiderman and X-Men titles.
We've got a Fantastic Four movie that's in the middle of production, talk about an Iron Man movie, talk about a Punisher and Daredevil sequel (not Elektra), a Ghost Rider movie....
How long before an Avengers movie?
Who knows. Considering their current lineup, maybe they're just going to completely rely on Spidey and Wolverine's presence to boost their sales.
I can hope and pray for a good Alpha Flight series to be reborn, but unfortunately, I'm not expecting anything...at least in the immediate future.

[Le Messor]

The movies, tho', include Iron Fist and Namor. And there's the Blade soon-to-be trilogy. They include obscure characters, and ones without current books - so why not AF?
I doubt they'll do a (good) Avengers movie soon. Too many characters which Marvel Movies don't have rights to - Hulk, Thor, Iron Man (all upcoming or recent movies). They could maybe make it out of second tier Avengers.

[ - edited by Ben to end certain discussions - ]

"What is in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet." - Juliet

- Le Messor.
"Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes."
- Thoreau

[Ben]

thread unlocked please continue the discussion

[cmdrkoenig67]

AF will be back...somehow, somewhere....somewhen.

Dana

[syvalois]

I have to agree with TK: not only would the government prolly keep a foundation like Dept H open, but they would prolly allecute more funds for it, as well as provide any cover-story they'd need.

Sorry guys, but Canada isn't quite as idealic as you'd like to think. O'course, in my eyes, it's better than most of the alternatives...


Idon't have a problem with Canada's corruption, it's with military funding I've got more problems with, just look at the Chicoutimi submarine fiasco.No,I see corruption in healt care, in income taxes, and in the prmotion of Canada, like what we call it in french "Les Commandites", non?