Hey guys I am new and I have something on my mind

[Matty]

Hello all I am new to the forum, and will hopefully be posting more in the future.

I wanna say right off that as a canadian artist/illustrator and general comic lover I have always liked the idea and the books of alpha flight, but I am curious I was about to pick up the new issue Omega flight and as I was flipping through it on my way to purchasing it at the counter, I saw something that at first didn't bother me, but as I looked at it and thought about it more it started to bug me. So my question to you is this, does anyone eles out there have a problem with the inclusion of the U.S Agent as a member of a Canadian Super Team. Honestly I will probably get some flack for this, and yes I am aware that on many other marvel teams there are canadian/american teamates. X-men for example with Northstar and Wolverine respectivly, but and this is a big but none of those characters have ever really been as how can I put this as glaringly patriotic as a Captain America knock off...I mean the man wears the AMERICAN FLAG.

now I know I sound harsh, and honestly I have no real beef with the character, despite the above, but for some reason a flag bearing american on what marvel is claiming as there CANADIAN SUPER TEAM leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

ah well, feel free to comment
and no hard feelings for those that luv it 8)

[Dfense75]

For a good reason to the "why" he is on the team. Pick up Civil War: Choosing Sides. It has a story in there about exactly why USAgent is with Omega Flight. In issue #3 itself it is said that Alpha Flight was never about being Canadian but about serving Canada. That statement and the Civil War: Choosing Sides story will give you all you need. USAgent is a jerk, obnoxious, conservative, right wing, republican, and his character represents "American arrogance". All of those things combined make USAgent for me the character I LOVE to hate. Every team on some level has that guy no one likes. Im sure we all have one we work with that we cant stand. But that kind of character provides alot of opportunity for a great group dynamic. Despite all of the above traits I threw out there USAgent is a hero. The man is pretty much without fear. If you wanna see a character defining moment...pick up some of the trades from the Invaders series he was in a few years back. He straight up OWNED Wolverine.

[Matty]

Yeah I actually have read that and the civil war as well so I do get it, and I guess as long as they kinda stick to the guy you "luv to hate" type character, I can get past it. I suppose I just really liked the original characters...and as said in the books characters like puck were never really canadian 100% hell I think even the original Guardian had American ties.

[SephirothsKiller]

In issue #3 itself it is said that Alpha Flight was never about being Canadian but about serving Canada. That statement and the Civil War: Choosing Sides story will give you all you need.

LOL. This statement was simply a weak justification of Pointer's presence on the team. Alphaflight had non-Canucks on it in the old days to be sure, but I think anyone who reads the Byrne issues will see that AF was clearly about being Canadian. (Obviously to be a good book it had to be about other things as well, and it was.)

Oeming was off base in his thoughts about this, he wasn't an AF reader and thus wouldn't fully get what AF was really about. That's why I'm judging the book as OF and not at all as AF vol. 4 (someday?)

[Le Messor]

USAgent is a hero. The man is pretty much without fear.

Now, Dfense, what if Daredevil had said that? "I'm Daredevil... the man pretty much without fear."

Matty, a lot of* your concerns were raised when Omega Flight was announced. You expressed them far more diplomatically and less harshly than people like, for example, me.

* a word which here means 'all'.

- Le Messor
Kingpin: "How do you kill a man without fear?"
Me: "Lock him in a room with something deadly that he's not afraid of."

[Mokole]

Welcome, Matty, thanks for your input. I'm no USagent fan but at least it gives us a Flight comic. I haven't chimed in on OF #3 yet, in the mail :cry: but I bet I'll disagree when I get it, I hope the pacing improves but the story and art are great, I know it!

BTW, no news from Mr. Oeming in Toronto?? :cry:

[cmdrkoenig67]

In issue #3 itself it is said that Alpha Flight was never about being Canadian but about serving Canada. That statement and the Civil War: Choosing Sides story will give you all you need.

LOL. This statement was simply a weak justification of Pointer's presence on the team. Alphaflight had non-Canucks on it in the old days to be sure, but I think anyone who reads the Byrne issues will see that AF was clearly about being Canadian. (Obviously to be a good book it had to be about other things as well, and it was.)


Wait...Seph, What members were not Canadians on the team in "the old days"?


Oeming was off base in his thoughts about this, he wasn't an AF reader and thus wouldn't fully get what AF was really about. That's why I'm judging the book as OF and not at all as AF vol. 4 (someday?)

Brings us back to Oeming saying that Omega is/was to be Alpha's last stand...It is sadly AF, Vol. 4. it was also said to be Alpha Flight, but not...The same could be said about Vols 2 and 3.

...And Matty...Just by looking at my signature, you could probably guess how I feel about AF...OF is unfortunately, the New Coke.

[kozzi24]

By composition of the team, and in what I think would have been better marketing tactic when you take into consideration how big the franchise is right now, I do think OF would have been better titled Avengers North. I agree with most or all of your specific points about USAgent's costume representing America in Canada, and the "insult" of having an American in the Guardian suit. The outer cloth could have been fashioned after some of the later GUardian designs or the Alpha team uniform.

[Matty]

...And Matty...Just by looking at my signature, you could probably guess how I feel about AF...OF is unfortunately, the New Coke.


Definatly, I really and honestly can't see this team lasting, It seems like it was kinda put together without really much thought, so I am really just waitin for the originals to return.

[SephirothsKiller]

...And Matty...Just by looking at my signature, you could probably guess how I feel about AF...OF is unfortunately, the New Coke.


Definatly, I really and honestly can't see this team lasting, It seems like it was kinda put together without really much thought, so I am really just waitin for the originals to return.

If they ever will... The thing is, Talisman and Sasquatch both have a pretty good following, and so if they were stuck on a team with the Twins then you would have a good selling book right there. Add the others into the mix sure, but those four should have been the core. Guardian isn't needed.

[Dfense75]

It has less to do with the character than it does the people creating the book. Before Grant Morrison took ok Animal Man he was a D-list hero with very little fan base. After a great run by an outstanding creative team the character became relevant and even popular. We can still have a good Alpha Flight book one day. Lets say Warren Ellis or Grant Morrison writing and Mark Silvestri or Jim Lee drawing. If any of those aformentioned creators where on an Alpha Flight book it would rock. For a book to be good it needs a good creative team. Its up to the publisher to acomplish that. It has been Marvel's failure to provide Alpha with the creators it needs. Now mind you...I LOVE the current creative team on Omega. They where given the **** end of the stick by Marvel before issue#1 even hit the stands with cutting the book to a mini. If given a chance(a chance they very much deserve) I think they would hit a home run on this book.

[Powersurge]

I would agree that Alpah Flight was as much about being Canadian as serving Canada. Simply saying it wasn't doesn't change the reality of the history of the team.

Not that I at all mind the prescence of a flag-waving Yank on the team. The truth is, whenever the subject of Canadian culture identity comes up, it is always defined in relation to the U.S. Our histories are intertwined, many of us have relatives on both sides of the border, etc.

If anything was an insult, IMO, it was placing an American in the "Canadian flag suit". Certainy, doing the reverse, placing a Canadian or whatever in the Cap.America suit would have caused massive outrage that would have far outstripped anything heard from Alphans.

In fact, come to think of it, how, exactly, does the Weapon Alpha battlesuit, the technological functions, help Pointer control his powers?!?

To my undestanding Mac's suit was geared toward electro-magnetic energy and it's manipulation, while Pointer's mutant power involved the absorption of mutant energies. So, I don't quite "get it".

However, if the technological functions of the suit are different, I would have to ask, why the Weapon Alpah "skin".

No matter, really. When all is said and done I'm enjoying the story, and would love it if this could turn into an on-going. It seems to have so much story-telling potential, but that potential is never going to be tapped in the space of a mini. And if it isn't tapped, well, then the prescence of a guy like USAgent is entirely lost.

[cmdrkoenig67]

I'll ask again...

Seph, What members were not Canadians on the team in "the old days"?

Dana

[Tiberius Bane]

Windshear wasn't Canadian was he? He was from England.

[cmdrkoenig67]

Windshear wasn't Canadian was he? He was from England.

Candian-born citizen living in England (later working in the US for Roxxon).

Dana

[Manikin]

Some of this has been touched on before, and though I think you(Matty) have a good attitude about the new Alpha/Omega Flight books regardless of your feelings towards US Agent, the fact remains that odds are this new version of Alpha Flight will fail.

I know what most of you might feel about that idea, but from what I have seen and read it continues to look more and more probable. I love the new books, I love long and drawn out stories, and I love a motley crew of unlikely heroes working together. It's a great series.

When we all think of Alpha Flight it brings about waves of pride, hell it was half the reason I even liked most of the characters as much as I do. But in this situation, in our own real world, this series needs all the help it can get. I mean that in the best possible way, mind you. The old Alpha Flight formula is flawed and it has shown in the last 2 versions. What I feel sets this apart from the rest is that instead of just pulling new Canadian characters out of thin air, or just repacking the old ones (like they did with Jeffries in V.2), they are using pre-established cult-favorites to revitalize the series. I personally like US Agent a lot, and really dislike Captain America. Just my personal tastes. There are also a lot of people out there that dislike AF only because they are Canadian. (Read other forums, it's true)

In the last few months I have been bringing each and every OF book to my work, handing it around to all my tech support buddies who used to read comics, and trying to get them back in the genre. The response has been good, but not great. AF will never be like it was. (Manikin will never come back except for in my own comic wish list)

In the end I think we all need to swallow our own pride like bitter tasting medicine, knowing that when it begins to work it will be worth it.