The (Vol.4) #4 Thread *CONTAINS SPOILERS*

[Phil]

Here's your official thread for discussion of all things #4.

There will be spoilers beyond here, as indicated in the thread title, but please remember the preview panel on the home page and leave

S

P

O

I

L

E

R

SPACE....

[Phil]

I LOVE IT I LOVE IT I LOVE IT!!!!!

Even though this is a spoiler-ful thread, I'm not going to say any anything specific.
I'm not even going to review the issue (for at least a week) because my excitement will jump through and spoil it all.

The last page is something I've been waiting years for.
You'll figure it out half way through the issue, but it's still an amazing reveal.
So glad they went this way!

[Alphan East]

The last page is something I've been waiting years for.

Absolutely 100% agree with you Phil. This is the direction that I hoped it was going in.
Don't worry... no spoilers in this. Just the ramblings of a fan that has waited so long for these characters to jump back onto a comic book page.
Words cannot describe how thrilled I am at how this series/story arc is shaping up. The plot is amazing... the art, as always, is incredible.
This is the first series of any kind in a LOOOONG while that has gotten me this excited in the comic industry. After reading this issue, I took a break, had a coffee, got some stuff done... then went back and read the variant cover version. Same story... didn't care. Loved it.
When you can enjoy reading a story this much and then realize that you have to wait another month to read the next chapter, and realizing that depresses you a little... you know you have a winner on your hands. :)

[varo]

you guys are killing me. my lcs is not even open yet!!!!

[varo]

read it. awesome!

[DelBubs]

Tomorrow, tomorrow, there's always tomorrow (bolloxs) :-(

[varo]

whats odd is my lcs only carried the jimenez cover, not dales variant, so i'm wondering, was the shadowed figure un-shadowed?

[Phil]

whats odd is my lcs only carried the jimenez cover, not dales variant, so i'm wondering, was the shadowed figure un-shadowed?

Nope.
The final covers are the ones up in the image gallery.

[varo]

so the one released in retail had the character shadowed?

[Phil]

That's correct.

[Legerd]

UGH! I have to work late today. It's possible there won't be any issues left at my LCS, and the other shop I go to as a back up will be closed by the time I get there. :mad: If so, I have to wait til' tomorrow to get a copy. :(

[DelBubs]

I have work tomorrow and Friday, out to dinner with my sister and her husband Friday and at my daughters all day Saturday. Would normally mean Monday before I got this. Luckily I have a good son who's doing a three hour round trip to get it for me tomorrow. God bless him.

[cmdrkoenig67]

so the one released in retail had the character shadowed?


That's correct.

I really think that's a good thing, as it adds a bit of mystery to the comic in a time when spoilers abound.

Dana

BTW: I have to say my LCS haven't had any of Dale's covers either, they've all had Jimenez covers every month.

As for the series...Absolutely love it (Spoilers: Heather murdering people and all even).

[Sypes]

Haven't been able to pick up my copies today, but reading this thread of "spoilers included" yet no spoilers in it is driving me mad with anticipation! I'm SO excited to read it tomorrow!!

[Alpha Rider]

I have work tomorrow and Friday, out to dinner with my sister and her husband Friday and at my daughters all day Saturday. Would normally mean Monday before I got this. Luckily I have a good son who's doing a three hour round trip to get it for me tomorrow. God bless him.

Miiinnee isssss jummping alll oovevr me eeee righht nooowww, assss weee sssspeeek.

[Ahab]

I just wish it had been a little longer - another sign of a good comic . Not that there wasn't enough, but wanted just a little more! Waifer thin mint?

[Silvian_Bruno]

SPOILERS:










How much do I want Alice Hu to be the new Groundhog full time?

[rplass]

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S

Yeah, in that splash panel it really seemed as if she were a member of AF, and I was thinking the exact same thing! Except, uh, Alice Hu as Groundhog, WTF?

[Legerd]

After AF defeats the baddies, and Heather goes to jail for life, Mac can marry Alice and she can be Vindicator. :p

[Sasquatch17]

Another strong issue with a terrific ending.

My only complaint is it was a little short.

[batman_von_gein]

i agree it did seem alittle short, but it was awesome. i don't know if i can make it a month to get the next one.

[Le Messor]

Well, I have to wait even longer! Not going to the LCS this weekend, next weekend I'll be in Sydney to see Alice... Not the Alpha Alice... then it's another two weeks before my next standing order day.


Haven't been able to pick up my copies today, but reading this thread of "spoilers included" yet no spoilers in it is driving me mad with anticipation!

I see you shiver...
with antici...
...
...
...
P!ation!

- Le Messor
"And superheroes come too late..."
~ Rocky Horror Picture Show

[DelBubs]

Read it, gonna read again (well after typing this). Didn't mind it being short cos of back up story. Another strong issue, and Dale's depiction of ___________ was spot on.

[Mokole]

I may be having a longer wait, as I will get #4 to #8 all at once. So months away....

[varo]

s


p


o

i


l


e


r



not sure how i didn't put 2 and 2 togther, but aurora was in the same contraption at the end of issue 2 that the master was in from the original series.

[Legerd]

I was able to get a copy on Wednesday, and have read it several times now. Finally...

S

P

O

I

L

E

R

S

... I know what was done to Heather to turn her into such a villain. And it makes sense that he could brainwash her so badly since he literally stripped her of her brain! How can she ever come back from that without going through a reverse Unity process?

[DelBubs]

S

P

O

I

L

E

R

S


It also clarifies how the Wendigo and Ranark can be so in control. Thinking about this last night, I was thinking Tom Thumb, Squadron Supreme and the Behaviour Modification Device.

[Phil]

S

P

O

I

L

E

R

S

I'm not sure the process has been applied to Wendigo and Ranark.
Would it work on Wendigo? Or is this a new Wendigo, whose human host pre-curse(for lack of a better word) had been Unified?
I'm sure Ranark has his own agenda too.

[Alphan East]

Here's a question that I'd like to pose to everyone... not sure if this means anything or if I may have simply missed something along the way. I'll put in the SPOILER gap, but I don't think this counts as it pertains more to info found in issue 3.

S

P

O

I

L

E

R

Walter suddenly cannot change into Sasquatch. Shortly after that, we see the new Alpha Strike team, which includes a Wendigo. But I don't recall anyone coming right out and saying that its a Wendigo. Is it possible that Ranark, who serves the Great Beasts, was needed on the team to help transfer Tanaraq into another host body, creating a white Sasquatch which would look similar to a Wendigo, and causing Walter to no longer be able to summon it ?
I know there are a lot of Alpha experts out there. Please tell me if I'm either onto something or way out in left field on this... don't worry, you won't hurt my feelings. :)

[Phil]

I'm pretty sure that the name has been mentioned in interviews.
You may well be on to something regardless though.

EDIT:

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=33004


And as far as Wendigo goes, just feel bad for Sasquatch, okay? This is gonna really hurt.
So that could be taken as to support your theory.

[Alphan East]

Interesting. This could be a whole new angle on the story.

Thanks for finding this Phil. :)

[Phil]

Well done for having the thought and making the possible connection.

I swear there was an interview somewhere with Fred & Greg that also mentioned him/it but I can't put my finger on it right now. I'll keep trying though.

EDIT:
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=34112


I like having Wendigo on Alpha Strike because Wendigo is this big, scary creature, and anyone who would put Wendigo, a cannibalistic unstoppable monster, on a superteam is obviously insane. That just goes to show you the mindset of the people running Department H.
which doesn't confirm or deny your thought.

[Le Messor]

S

P

O

I

L

E

R

S

Or is this a new Wendigo, whose human host pre-curse(for lack of a better word) had been Unified?

Which, if true, would mean the people controlling this person had made it be a cannibal!


Is it possible that Ranark, who serves the Great Beasts, was needed on the team to help transfer Tanaraq into another host body, creating a white Sasquatch which would look similar to a Wendigo, and causing Walter to no longer be able to summon it ?

Given Sasquatch's history, and what we know of it, in theory that shouldn't work. (Not saying you're not right, but...)
Okay, the original Sas originally co-hosted with Tanaraq.
Then, Snowbird went to a Tanaraq Salon, and started apeing him.
And then, she killed him.
And then, he revived - in her body. Despite her time in the tanning salon, he was very, very white.
And then, Talisman came and made him orange again. And he liked being a dude.
BUT... by now, he was no longer Tanaraq himself - just a bird doing anthropomorphic ape imitations.

Ergo, Sasquatch hasn't been a host body for Tanaraq since mid-volume 1. Concordantly, having somebody else host should not stop Walter's transformation vis-a-vis Sasquatch. Ipso facto!


I know there are a lot of Alpha experts out there. Please tell me if I'm either onto something or way out in left field on this... don't worry, you won't hurt my feelings. :)

Then we'll have to find another way...
Your mother was a hamster and your father smelled of eldeberries!


I like having Wendigo on Alpha Strike because Wendigo is this big, scary creature, and anyone who would put Wendigo, a cannibalistic unstoppable monster, on a superteam is obviously insane. That just goes to show you the mindset of the people running Department H.

I'd say that strongly implies - without confirming - that it is Wendigo after all.

- Le Messor
"I eat cannibals,
It's incredible!"
~ Toto Coelo

[cmdrkoenig67]

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
It's definitely the Wendigo, he has a tail...

http://www.alphaflight.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=1373&d=1313447067

Dana

[Phil]

Ergo, Sasquatch hasn't been a host body for Tanaraq since mid-volume 1. Concordantly, having somebody else host should not stop Walter's transformation vis-a-vis Sasquatch. Ipso facto!
Wasn't he possessed by Tanaraq in the Omega Flight ltd series?

[Le Messor]

Wasn't he possessed by Tanaraq in the Omega Flight ltd series?

Um... Yes.
(Forgot about it, but I've just checked.) At least, as Talisman put it:
"Yes... he's been... Repossessed!"
Uh, checking the exact dialogue:
"He's possessed by the Great Beasts!"
She later specifies Tanaraq by name.

But later, in the same issue, he's "overcome the evil" and is still seen to transform.
I'm still not sure his current ability to change into Sasquatch is affected by Tanaraq, even if he's vulnerable to possession in that form.

But I don't know how Freg are writing it.

- Le Messor
"The darkest hour of any man's life is when he sits down to plan how to get money without earning it."
~ Horace Greeley

[Phil]

not sure how i didn't put 2 and 2 togther, but aurora was in the same contraption at the end of issue 2 that the master was in from the original series.

Indeed, very similar to both that and the one Marrina was in, but not drawn exactly the same so as to give the game away too early.
Very nicely done indeed.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

#4 is pretty good.

[Le Messor]

#4 is pretty good.

Spoiler space, man, spoiler space!

[Readsreads]

Now, this is how you tell a series and with the final page reveal. Everything is making sense with this new direction. Love it!

[-K-M-]

Ha! Called it!

Great issue.

[-K-M-]

Ergo, Sasquatch hasn't been a host body for Tanaraq since mid-volume 1. Concordantly, having somebody else host should not stop Walter's transformation vis-a-vis Sasquatch. Ipso facto!


Snowbird got possessed by Tanaraq during the Pestilence story as well.

[Jason Eberly]

Snowbird got possessed by Tanaraq during the Pestilence story as well.

I thought that Pestilence merely controlled Snowbird because she had assumed the form of the Great Beast, but wasn't actually possessed by Tanaraq?

If only there were someone with the whole run of Alpha Flight by their computer that could check it real quick...

[-K-M-]

I thought that Pestilence merely controlled Snowbird because she had assumed the form of the Great Beast, but wasn't actually possessed by Tanaraq?

If only there were someone with the whole run of Alpha Flight by their computer that could check it real quick...

Yep, same thing and showed that Snowbird could become the embodiment of Tanaraq. In Alpha Flight Annual #2 [Vol.1], Snowbird mentioned to Vindicator if she took the form of Sasquatch too long she would lose control and Vindicator scolded her

and then near the end of vol.1 during the fight with Wrecker mentioned Walter was losing more and more control, but didnt know if it was Tanaraq or not but Omega Flight verified it was (again with the Wrecker).

[Garry/Al-Fan]

Spoiler space, man, spoiler space!

Sweet Christmas! I barely had enough time to walk from the subway station to the library to type that one sentence before the librarian shut the computers down @ 5:15, instead of the super-scathing, ultra-caustic, totally biased rantique that would've surely gotten me banned from this site for life, caused Dale to jump ship back to DC comics, and made MARVEL cancel the series with # 5:

"Freg" sounds like a new cuss word.

[Le Messor]

If only there were someone with the whole run of Alpha Flight by their computer that could check it real quick...

:) If only I wasn't away from the 'net for two days in a row...


The Great Beasts could employ death and decay as weapons against mankind! But I command death and decay just as I can control their a nts, the Great sts themsel es! That includes (...) Sasquatch!

So, yes, he could only control her because she had the form of a Great Beast.
And, yes, my issue has an oddly diamond-shaped printer error... wait! 'Agents'! That first word must be 'agents'!


Snowbird mentioned to Vindicator if she took the form of Sasquatch too long she would lose control

That's true with any animal. (cf the wolverine in Uncanny #140.)


the librarian shut the computers down @ 5:15, instead of the super-scathing, ultra-caustic, totally biased rantique

Are you saying you were out of your brain on the 5:15?

- Le Messor
Buffy: I'd like to find Willow and Xander.
Joyce: Will you be slaying? Buffy: Only if they give me lip.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

...

Are you saying you were out of your brain on the 5:15?

- Le Messor
...

That would probably be an improvement, at any time. But no, just if I had had more time, I would've written something longer (and still would've forgotten to put in a
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
space. I would've had to mention: (1) Mac's flag-suit is full of holes when he tosses it, but is good-as-new when he re-dons it [did Shaman repair it? Could that have been mentioned/shown?]; (2) the team-in-the-van is well-done but I wish we could have a little bit more of that all-inclusive interplay!, and; (3) I hope Shaman and Snowbird get played up a little bit more, especially if this Serpent thing is mystical in nature, but coherent & practical, like they are portrayed in # 4.

I know a lot has to happen in 20 pages (21 if you count the recap page), but Aurora & Northstar haven't gotten short-changed; neither should Shaman nor Snowbird.

[cmdrkoenig67]

I agree, Garry...And all it takes sometimes, is a few lines for Narya and Michael to keep them involved and interesting.

Dana

[Canucklehead]

I agree Garry. I'm sure they'll get their face time though. I think the writers really wanted to focus on Mac and Marrina for the original Mini.

I've got three questions of my own:
(1) Why wasn't Snowbird in her Anne form at the border?
(2) The panel where Marrina yells "Die Alien Scum!" did anyone else think Mac was slapping Snowbird in the bottom right corner? Or was it just me?
(3) On the last page, is Claire holding a sippy-cup or a cell phone!?!

[Legerd]

I agree Garry. I'm sure they'll get their face time though. I think the writers really wanted to focus on Mac and Marrina for the original Mini.

I've got three questions of my own:
(1) Why wasn't Snowbird in her Anne form at the border?
(2) The panel where Marrina yells "Die Alien Scum!" did anyone else think Mac was slapping Snowbird in the bottom right corner? Or was it just me?
(3) On the last page, is Claire holding a sippy-cup or a cell phone!?!

1. Because Shaman was using a spell to disguise them, and it would probably confuse readers if Snowbird appeared disguised by the spell while the rest were in costume. Plus, it's more of a WTF?! moment when you see her as Snowbird talking with the border guard before you find out Shaman is working a spell.
2. I don't know about everyone else, but I'll say it's just you.
3. I'd say it was a sippy cup, but nowadays it could be either.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

Pestilence---the character from Alpha Flight vol. 1---highjacks the essence of Snowbird's baby...who at best is one-quarter immortal (grandfather: Richard Easton, mortal; grandmother: NELVANNA, goddess/immortal; mother: Narya, demi-goddess, and; father, Doug Thompson, mortal).

There are SEVEN Great Beasts in this series at that point: SOMON (whose heart Snowbird ripped out in # 24), TANARAQ, Tundra, Tolamaq, Kolomaq, (even) Ranaq, and Kariooq, all of whom claim to be immortal [and SOMON has proven it, if he can return from what happened to him in # 24]. The notion that Pestilence could "control" one of the GREAT BEASTS is far-fetched, at best; to believe that he controlled six-to-seven of them is...unbelievable.

[cmdrkoenig67]

This issue was very good...
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
?
I'm kind of surprised "Aurora's" comment about waiting for Jean Paul to find a nice girl to settle down with didn't raise some suspicions among her Alphan van-mates.

Dana

[Alpha Rider]

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S

It's obvious that Jean- Marie is in charge of her body and not Aurora. If you look at the last issue you could see that Jean- Marie and Aurora have differnt coloured eyes.

[bigbloo]

I agree Garry. I'm sure they'll get their face time though. I think the writers really wanted to focus on Mac and Marrina for the original Mini.

I've got three questions of my own:
(1) Why wasn't Snowbird in her Anne form at the border?
(2) The panel where Marrina yells "Die Alien Scum!" did anyone else think Mac was slapping Snowbird in the bottom right corner? Or was it just me?
(3) On the last page, is Claire holding a sippy-cup or a cell phone!?!

Plus, how does she drive while wearing that cape? Is that a godly power as well?

Great solid issue!

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
P
A
C
E

Though I thought they could have drawn out the "Mac loses faith in Canada" plot for a bit longer. It seemed a bit rushed to have him doubt at the beginning of the issue and then get back on board at the end. I would have liked a bit more soul searching...

[Phil]

It's obvious that Jean- Marie is in charge of her body and not Aurora. If you look at the last issue you could see that Jean- Marie and Aurora have differnt coloured eyes.
I think that's an artistic device for the reader rather than actual thing.

[Alpha Rider]

I think that's an artistic device for the reader rather than actual thing.

That is true, Jean-Marie's eye never changed colour before back in Vol I, so they totally did it for effect, or unless it's a new augmented power because she never was ale to tap into Aurora's power while in the J.M. state of mind.

BTW my eyes change colours too.

[Jason Eberly]

This issue was very good...
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
?
I'm kind of surprised "Aurora's" comment about waiting for Jean Paul to find a nice girl to settle down with didn't raise some suspicions among her Alphan van-mates.

Dana

Perhaps it did, and AF is playing along for some reason which we'll find out later.

[cmdrkoenig67]

That's a possibility, Jason.

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
.
.
.
.
I see "Unity" is actually rebuilding people...Kyle has been totally rebuilt by the Master's devices...They probably did it to Purple Woman, etc.. Perhaps Heather had been rebuild too?

Dana

BTW: I know Jeanne-Marie is posing as Aurora, that's why I typed "Aurora" in my post.

[cmdrkoenig67]

Plus, how does she drive while wearing that cape? Is that a godly power as well?

Great solid issue!

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
P
A
C
E

Though I thought they could have drawn out the "Mac loses faith in Canada" plot for a bit longer. It seemed a bit rushed to have him doubt at the beginning of the issue and then get back on board at the end. I would have liked a bit more soul searching...

I agree about Mac...It should have taken more than the equivalent of a few hours (or however much time passed in the issue, it certainly didn't seem very long). I do like that Marrina retrieved the suit right after Mac tossed it (during her little dip)...It's a good glimpse into her character and how much she cares for Mac and her team-mates.

Dana

[Phil]

Perhaps Heather had been rebuild too?

That was my thought, which would explain her line at the end of #1; She genuinely believes what she said.

[Le Messor]

That is true, Jean-Marie's eye never changed colour before back in Vol I, so they totally did it for effect, or unless it's a new augmented power because she never was ale to tap into Aurora's power while in the J.M. state of mind.
BTW my eyes change colours too.

And the artistic device here is used to show mind control more than change of personalities.

Um... which are you?

- Le Messor
"I'd rather be _right_ than happy."

[Alpha Rider]

And the artistic device here is used to show mind control more than change of personalities.

Um... which are you?

- Le Messor
"I'd rather be _right_ than happy."

It's hard to tell at times. Do I think that? Or is someone else typing this? I know that I just work for the post office. That should clear things up.

[bigbloo]

That's a possibility, Jason.

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
.
.
.
.
I see "Unity" is actually rebuilding people...Kyle has been totally rebuilt by the Master's devices...They probably did it to Purple Woman, etc.. Perhaps Heather had been rebuild too?

Dana

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
P
A
C
E

I wonder if the rebuilt Kyle is still a homosexual?

[Le Messor]

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
P
A
C
E

I wonder if the rebuilt Kyle is still a homosexual?

Whenever I read 'Kyle' I still translate to 'Wildchild' - so that question threw me for a moment.

(I don't have any answers, just thought I'd mention.)

- Le Messor
Calvin: I'll bet you'd rather have a bowl of tasty, lip-smacking crunchy-on-the-outside, chewey-on-the-inside, chocolate frosted sugar bombs! Can I pour you some?
Dad: No, thanks. I'm trying to reach middle age.

[Legerd]

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
P
A
C
E

I wonder if the rebuilt Kyle is still a homosexual?

Definitely. I seriously doubt Freg would take away Northstar's love interest in so offhand a manner, unless they were going to later restore him to normal.

[Phil]

Yeah, there'd be a lynching if so.