Jeffries appearance in All-New X-Factor? *SPECULATION*

[Phil]

3290So, it appears from the All-New X-Factor #1 Variant that Danger is going to be part of the team. Following on from their...relationship in X-Club I wonder if we'll get a cameo, or even a mention, of him?

I've asked Peter David on Twitter; I doubt he can answer yet, but we'll see!

[-K-M-]

Danger posing like that is off-putting and those costumes are terrible haha. Is that Machine Man though?

[Phil]

In the hood? Current opinion is Warlock.

PAD gave a 'Maybe.' as expected, but I'll be picking the series up anyway so will keep an eye out!

[Flightpath07]

Danger posing like that is off-putting and those costumes are terrible haha. Is that Machine Man though?

At least they are bright!

[-K-M-]

In the hood? Current opinion is Warlock.
Guy with Gambit hair, but properly Rictor

[Phil]

It's Gambit.

[-K-M-]

Shoot :(

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSSgl5008Kfjb0wtUVjTP5moPV-5kh7vCZs-mDxLjtddS_weUg52Q

[Calbretto]

I love the idea of putting Madison Jeffries in X-Factor. I'll be picking up this new book either way, but I'd love to see one of my favourite Alpans join the main cast.

[rplass]

I love the idea too. And welcome to the boards, Calbretto!

[Chris]

At least they are bright!

So bright they need red tinted glasses to look at each other.

Madison Jeffries would be a great addition. Last time we saw him was in AvX: VS #6 last October.

[Phil]

Having three Alphans as regulars in three different books would be pretty nice. And I'd love to see PAD write the character.

I don't think he'll be a main character though. Chances are he won't be in it at all, but maybe we'll get a comment from Danger about their relationship. Preferably it being over.

[Flightpath07]

Personally, I'd like to see Madison go a little screwy and 'accidentally' remake Delphine Courtney...

[Phil]

I dunno... after Weapon X I'm pretty tired of crazy Madison... that's just me though. If it made for a decent story I'd probably change my mind.

[Flightpath07]

Well, it could be a bit like a Hank Pym/Ultron type thing. Or Jeffries could be creating another date for himself.

[Le Messor]

Having three Alphans as regulars in three different books would be pretty nice. And I'd love to see PAD write the character.

PAD is on top of my list to write Alpha Flight.

~ Le Messor
"How was I supposed to know the tiger wasn't housebroken?"
~ Morgan, Chuck

[EccentricSage]

I would just love to see a writer address Madison's PTSD and obvious issues instead of making a joke of him. I think he has so much potential ether to be the underdog character who pulls himself together and does something amazing when the chips are down, or else become completely disillusioned and go rogue... maybe a bit of a villain, though not the cackling evil type... just a guy with his own ideas and fears who's actions pit him against the standard heroes at some points. That would be great. Marvel just kills me with all the wasted potential.

[Calbretto]

Madison turning villain reminds me too much of his brother and whole Omega thing with Rogers Bochs. I'd rather see Madison remain a hero.

[EccentricSage]

I wasn't thinking in those terms, though. I just want a good story where he's not incompetent or nuts. Being a villain doesn't doom you, ether, villains can be pretty beloved when written well and not just used as a foil for the heroes. Also, Marvel is running rather low on good villains, isn't it? Too often it's villains going hero or two heroes vs eachother over an issue of moral ambiguity, etc. It would be nice to see any ill used character step up to fill the void and act as a compelling enemy with real reasons for their actions, IMO. I wouldn't want it if it destroys him, though. Better yet, a story where the character represented as the villain ends up being right, or actually saves the day, etc. Could be fun.

I like playing around with ideas. If I can get a coherent story written down, I'd love to get into the industry some day... but I'm so scatterbrained. lol I have sooooooooo many ideas, though! ;___;

I have an idea for a book revolving around Madison going mad scientist with a secret underground lab no one knows about, haunted by voices from the beyond which are guiding him in using his abilities to collect knowledge and ideas from all the geniuses he's been exposed to. He's being guided to right some wrongs of the past because he can't get over all the losses he's suffered... loved ones who've ether died in his arms or by his own hands. He becomes obsessed with bringing various people back, but who are these voices really? What are their true intentions? I imagine it starting out as a sort of trippy horror story and then they get dragged into another dimension which transitions the story to a more fairy tale like concept exploring the psychology and social dynamics of various characters who get dragged in. All of this being manipulated by a specific AF villain whom I think is overdue for a big story arc and probably quite starved for some entertainment.

Mind you, Mad Madison would be temporary. I just don't think it would make sense for him to suddenly be a mentally healthy person after everything that's happened. He could be given the chance to confront his demons and find some closure during the coarse of the story as I'm conceptualizing it. He'd come out strong again by the end after a lot of soul searching.

I don't think Marvel would ever buy it, though, because even if they could get past the use of an all obscure cast, there would be no way to condense the ideas I have into a Maxi without ruining the story. -__-

[Le Messor]

Madison turning villain reminds me too much of his brother and whole Omega thing with Rogers Bochs. I'd rather see Madison remain a hero.

You've obviously been reading a long time. Or at least, furiously collecting back issues.

Sage -
That sounds like it could be a cool series. I'm guessing DreamQueen is your übervillain? Though, Madison absorbing all that knowledge and ideas is inconsistent with his power-set.

(And, if Marvel did use it, you know it'd be another "heroes"-vs-"heroes" thing.)

~ Le Messor
"Make it idiot proof and someone will make a better idiot."

[EccentricSage]

You've obviously been reading a long time. Or at least, furiously collecting back issues.

Sage -
That sounds like it could be a cool series. I'm guessing DreamQueen is your übervillain? Though, Madison absorbing all that knowledge and ideas is inconsistent with his power-set.

(And, if Marvel did use it, you know it'd be another "heroes"-vs-"heroes" thing.)

~ Le Messor
"Make it idiot proof and someone will make a better idiot."

The knowledge absorption was always a thing, though, wasn't it? I remember him and Bochs working that way. Until he became overpowered and could just pull space ships out of his ass without any expertise, anyhow. I think instead of writers just nerfing his powers like they have, there should just be a return to him needing the ideas of greater minds in order to build greater things. The way I think it could be handled is that he would retain the information, but not the ability to comprehend all of it. It would actually be someone working under Dreamy who'd be guiding him in using the stolen ideas.

I just imagine him becoming this huge threat to people like Tony Stark because even if Madison couldn't use the ideas without the help of someone who understands them guiding him, anyone with the intellect who could harness some sort of power to explore his mind could steal Stark Technology... not from a computer or a file, just the pure ideas right from a mind. So I could actually see it serving Marvel's addiction to huge team vs team events and such in the long run. lol Also imagine Dream Queen escaping to the mortal world with new found understanding of the human heart and mind. So many under used characters that could be so much fun. Maybe have her prey on the minds of outcasts in the real world to create a new set of super villains, with Omega Flight kind of caught in this middle ground between villainy and heroism. It wouldn't be too dark and gritty, though, because the main thing I like to think about is the interpersonal relationships of these characters and how the time in Live World as Dreamy's pawns would really unify them as a group of people who care about and need each other.

In her world I'd have them remember their pasts in a fictitious fantasy world variation, but not remember each other. It would be a barbaric and largely lawless world like something out of a videogame or D&D. A world where the characters are pretty much free to be themselves and are just reacting to her manipulation and scenarios she throws at them. So when they get back to the real world they really have to look out for eachother because it's a culture shock. They'd have this very survivalist mentality but are trying to keep eachother out of trouble. I swear to god if I can just get a hold of the back issues I need to research all the characters besides the ones I know well, I'll write this damn thing as a fanfiction and be done with it. It's been niggling the back of my mind for a couple years now, I think, and just keeps getting more complex. lol Got to get it out of there. XD And can you imagine if they got caught up in the drama of Heather Hudson's situation? I'd have her as a runaway trying to start a new life under a false identity, and Mac I'd have desperately searching for her and his child, and trying to broker her freedom as she is a murderer now who worked for the enemy, but he knows it wasn't her fault. I mean, imagine that cast of characters, given that so many of them have been victims of mind control...

[marvelnowfansite]

This whole tread is a fascinating read! I love it!!

Madison Jeffries, Sage and Forge are some of my fav mutant characters in the Marvel Universe. If either one of them decided to create, or re-create the Reavers / Sentinels; OUCH!

Forget Sage's past alliance with the Hellfire Club... just imagine Madison Jeffries as on of the Four Horseman of Apocalypse?!

[Le Messor]

The knowledge absorption was always a thing, though, wasn't it? I remember him and Bochs working that way.

We didn't see them working together, exactly - only the results. We see them meet up, then Bochs test-flying the new robot - and complimenting Jeffries on his idea to make Bochs phase into the armour, rather than control it remotely.
I don't remember even a hint of there being any knowledge absorption?

~ Le Messor
"Managers know it must be good because the programmers hate it so much."

[EccentricSage]

Le Messor, it was explained on panel. Unless we interpret it differently somehow?

3333

[Le Messor]

ES - Nothing about that first one makes me think he's taking ideas from people's heads. Just that machines like to imitate him.
The second? Yes, now that you bring it up, I do remember, and you're right. Sorry, I tend to forget the post-Byrne stuff, most especially the Mantlo stuff. But you are definitely right about it based on that second one.

[EccentricSage]

The one page was a mistake, and I tried to fix it and... yeah... XD But you get my point. lol I got confused and thought that was another page concerning this, for some reason I thought there was something Byrne Era concerning it, but now I can't find it.

Yeah, I personally LIKE that addition to how his powers work, regardless of the rest of what Mantlo did. It makes a lot more sense and places a natural limit on his abilities while still leaving room for writers to create scenarios where he can use his abilities on a higher level. After all, Madison is but a humble mechanic, he shouldn't be able to make very complex things on his own, he should only be able to alter mechanical things, destroy them, or fix what already exists. A lot of what he's done over the years makes no sense at all without him being able to use the ideas of people who have the engineering know how and creative understanding of mechanics, programming, and robotics that he lacks to create the things he's created.

[Le Messor]

The one page was a mistake,

Oddly enough, though, it was the same page I was thinking about when I was originally trying to figure out what you meant.
(For those who came in late, after ES fixed it: it's the page where Bochs first reveals Jeffries' powers, by throwing the works at him; and the works turn into an arm.)


Yeah, I personally LIKE that addition to how his powers work, regardless of the rest of what Mantlo did. It makes a lot more sense

It does make sense of his abilities, I'll give you that. :)
(Though I think, originally, Byrne had his powers be that he could make mechanical parts imitate him - he didn't need to know anything about robotics or anything, his powers just made copies. The spaceships and stuff should've been out of his league, though.)


After all, Madison is but a humble mechanic,

Not even that - he used to 'dig ditches for a livin''. (See the Byrne page you posted, or one very close to it.)

~ Le Messor
"Many hands make light work."

[EccentricSage]

Yeah, but besides digging ditches, he was in the military during Vietnam with his brother, subtly using their powers to aid the troops. I don't have a scan, but I remember Madison being a mechanic handling maintenance and repairs while his brother was a medic.

See, I think the whole space ship thing should be doable if he has geniuses working with him and the raw materials available. That's where it gets tricky. He shouldn't be able to do something like that quickly, nor should he be able to pull it out of thin air, nor random rubble or scrap.

[Le Messor]

Well, he did have a whole villain's lair to work with.

[Jason Eberly]

Even though I loved the design of the Jeffries' Box armor, I always preferred his power to be an intuitive one. Like when he made the arm out of the spare parts, it would only work (bend, flex, etc.) as long as he continued to actively use his power on it. When he stopped (or even if he didn't) and you cut that arm open, you wouldn't see synthetic muscles or anything...just scrap in what Jeffries' thinks the interior of an arm would look like.

So he would need someone like Bochs to direct him in manipulating materials to make a device (robot or whatever) that would work when Jeffries wasn't actively controlling it. And the whole "pulling it directly out of people's head" thing...blech.

But that's my personal preference. Heroes and villains always seem to get more powerful and their powers more versatile as the years go by. I would like to see them less powerful, thereby creating more adversity in their adventures.

(That includes intelligence...I know I've vented about this before, but Tony Stark should just be an [albeit gifted] engineer, not a "futurist" who can make anything from any discipline, Hank Pym should be primarily a biochemist, Bruce Banner a physicist, and Hank McCoy a...whatever he is [biochemist?], not these Reed Richard/Victor Von Doom level scientists.)

[Le Messor]

Heroes and villains always seem to get more powerful and their powers more versatile as the years go by. I would like to see them less powerful, thereby creating more adversity in their adventures.

That kind of makes sense from a narrative flow POV, (they're learning and developing with time and practice; and their adventures 'have to be bigger' <-- I actually don't like that attitude) but still... For me, it makes them more generic, as they all turn into each other.

[Jason Eberly]

That kind of makes sense from a narrative flow POV, (they're learning and developing with time and practice; and their adventures 'have to be bigger' <-- I actually don't like that attitude) but still... For me, it makes them more generic, as they all turn into each other.

Exactly. That's why I think it's important to occasionally (either subtly or overtly) "reset" a character's powers. Otherwise, they turn into Superman. Like what DC did with Crisis On Infinite Earths. Even though they seemed to have done the opposite with The New 52, making the characters more god-like and powerful (and bland).

[EccentricSage]

Even though I loved the design of the Jeffries' Box armor, I always preferred his power to be an intuitive one. Like when he made the arm out of the spare parts, it would only work (bend, flex, etc.) as long as he continued to actively use his power on it. When he stopped (or even if he didn't) and you cut that arm open, you wouldn't see synthetic muscles or anything...just scrap in what Jeffries' thinks the interior of an arm would look like.

So he would need someone like Bochs to direct him in manipulating materials to make a device (robot or whatever) that would work when Jeffries wasn't actively controlling it. And the whole "pulling it directly out of people's head" thing...blech.

But that's my personal preference. Heroes and villains always seem to get more powerful and their powers more versatile as the years go by. I would like to see them less powerful, thereby creating more adversity in their adventures.

(That includes intelligence...I know I've vented about this before, but Tony Stark should just be an [albeit gifted] engineer, not a "futurist" who can make anything from any discipline, Hank Pym should be primarily a biochemist, Bruce Banner a physicist, and Hank McCoy a...whatever he is [biochemist?], not these Reed Richard/Victor Von Doom level scientists.)

Yeah, I don't like the idea that pulling the ideas out of someone's mind is instantaneous and unlimited. I like an idea that the information would be beyond his understanding without the aid of someone who understands it. This would limit his powers but leave room for him to do some insane stuff with the right people collaborating. It would also help smooth over inconsistancies in how his powers have been used over the years. I really like looking at characters with inconsistent histories and figuring out how to make it work. I probably became a fan of Wildchild in part BECAUSE there's so much to play with, for example.


That kind of makes sense from a narrative flow POV, (they're learning and developing with time and practice; and their adventures 'have to be bigger' <-- I actually don't like that attitude) but still... For me, it makes them more generic, as they all turn into each other.

I agree with both points. I like realistic narrative flow, but I hate the emphasis on power levels and wins. So often books seem to devolve into a pro-wrestling like story where all that matters is who wins the most fights. It's pathetic. It's not real story telling, it's just a bunch of fanboys who made it into the industry wanking about how cool their guy is and trashing other characters to 'prove it'.

I think power progression can work so long as there is some weakness, risk, or limitation to keep it in check. I think lesser writers only look at what they want to do short term and use characters as plot devices rather than focusing on strong characterization and reasonable character development.

[marvelnowfansite]

Even though I loved the design of the Jeffries' Box armor, I always preferred his power to be an intuitive one. Like when he made the arm out of the spare parts, it would only work (bend, flex, etc.) as long as he continued to actively use his power on it. When he stopped (or even if he didn't) and you cut that arm open, you wouldn't see synthetic muscles or anything...just scrap in what Jeffries' thinks the interior of an arm would look like.

So he would need someone like Bochs to direct him in manipulating materials to make a device (robot or whatever) that would work when Jeffries wasn't actively controlling it. And the whole "pulling it directly out of people's head" thing...blech.

But that's my personal preference. Heroes and villains always seem to get more powerful and their powers more versatile as the years go by. I would like to see them less powerful, thereby creating more adversity in their adventures.

(That includes intelligence...I know I've vented about this before, but Tony Stark should just be an [albeit gifted] engineer, not a "futurist" who can make anything from any discipline, Hank Pym should be primarily a biochemist, Bruce Banner a physicist, and Hank McCoy a...whatever he is [biochemist?], not these Reed Richard/Victor Von Doom level scientists.)

This makes total sense and agree. If Madison Jeffries mutant powers grew, he could literally control and create Sentinels. There are too may omnipotent omega class mutants and even ordinary people in the Marvel Universe that could simply end the entire Universe with an idea, or a thought.

[Le Messor]

Hasn't he already been known to control Sentinels?

~ Le Messor
"Mathematicians deal with proofs of absolute certainty because they get to define completely the universe their proofs exists in. Scientists have no such luxury."
~ Mark Isaac

[Phil]

Sorta... In the Weapon X: Days Of Future Now mini his Box-Bots evolved. But that's an alternate future.

He took a Sentinel down in X-Men: Schism #4 too.

[Jason Eberly]

Hasn't he already been known to control Sentinels?

In Alpha Flight #43, did he control any of the Sentinels? I know he transformed one of them first into a flight suit for himself, then a big spear to take out another, but I don't remember if he did anything else.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

The Sentinels didn't save any humans, they didn't capture Mesmero, and most of Alpha Flight didn't do diddly against them. All that, and Aurora was in her summer-suit (yellow-and-white), when the next issue (just getting back from the Sentinel fight) shows her in the purple outfit.

The Mantlo era...gotta love it.

[-K-M-]

His last appearance in Weapon X he created a Sentinel army, and was part of the Weapon X war which ended because of House of M. Saw his sentinels fighting Wild Child.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d187/A_Flight/weaponx22b.jpg

[Phil]

All-New X-Factor #4 is out today and I can't make it to a shop today so if anyone that is wants to have a browse to see if MadJef gets a mention at all...?

[rplass]

I think you mean X-Factor #5. I didn't see any mention of MadJef.

[Phil]

Hmm. It must be on a two-week schedule this month then...
#4 is the Danger issue, and #3 only came out 4 weeks ago.
I'll try and find #4.