Just livin' in the past...
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Just livin' in the past...
Nice. Going to color it?
-K-M-:
I don't plan on coloring it, although coloring it would bring volume and 3-dimensionality to the sketches. I've been reading Andy Schmidt's The Insider's Guide to Creating Comics and Graphic Novels; I'm beginning to understand why the big 2 comic companies divide the duties up between a writer, a penciller, an inker, a letterer, and a colorist...so each can bring the best to the story, on-time.
I'm working on the penciller-inker part, at the moment.
Garry
lost in space
So that will be your first page?
One thing I've done - I'm sure you've thought of this already - that makes drawing space easier is to draw a bunch of dots on a page. I then scan it in and flip the colours / make a negative image. It's pretty effective.
~ LM
Cool. I will try it.
I'm doing things on a broken shoe-string, but I will try it.
It can be my first page, but right now it's just the 2nd illustration in the very, very brief history of Alpha Flight. The 1st illustration [of original Alpha Flight] is the beginning, the 2nd is the middle, and the 3rd one will be the end.
Oblivion....or rejuvenation?
Crazy.
Creepy.
Eerie.
I don't recognise the first two... Jaxom and somebody from v2?
~ Le Messor
"Everyone is ignorant, only on different subjects"
~ Will Rogers
Scroll to the very bottom, dude.
The bottom of Garry's post, or the bottoms of the pdfs?
I'm sorry if I'm being dense, but I've read those and I still don't know. 8-[ :confused:
I'm confused about this, too, unless it refers to the issues the quotes come from...
Not at all. MARVEL characters are MARVEL characters. Some of the characters are clearly who they are intended to be, some aren't.
Thanks, Garry.
Is #1 from volume 2, too, then? I don't know that series so well...
~ Le Messor
"Expect more than others think is possible."
~ Vince Lombardi
Okay, that's less confusing. :)
These are awesome, Gary! Can't wait to see the rest of your work. Do you happen to have a Deviant page?
Sorry, Hydro, no Deviant page. Just thumbnail sketches on typing paper. The Insider's Guide to Creating Comics suggests laying out things in thumbnail, which I'm trying to do.
Since MARVEL has pretty much demolished the original concept of ALPHA FLIGHT and published the assassination of the original characters' character (in volume 4), it's just a nostalgic trip down memory lane.
Do they? I've recently started drawing my own comic*, and I'm doing my own weird style of layouts (sometimes thumbnails, sometimes sketching a bunch of panels I'll need, then figuring out how they'll go together on a page), but I've figured out that one advantage I have over a professional is, I have time to draft. It makes sense, but I wouldn't have thought it'd give a pro much time. (I'm not doing it 9-5 like a pro would, but it can still take weeks to do a single page.)
Do you refer here to the Fear Itself volume? (That's the only one that fits the description, but I think of it as v5 - I imagine you're not counting Omega?)
* I got tired of doing random doodles during meetings at work, and started doing a comic instead. True story.
~ Le Messor
"Forget it. No Civil War picture ever made a nickel."
~ MGM executive, advising against investing in Gone With The Wind
I've considered it. The only copies I have electronic at the moment are pdfs, though. I was about to say that's not suitable for (direct) posting here, but I don't actually know.
Also, I consider it to be in draft mode: I've been taking the versions I've done at work (which is up to page 14) and taking it home and redrawing it on graph paper at comic artboard size (I've got about 9 of those done), but it turns out graph paper shows up in scans far too well. I haven't inked yet. (I'll probably trace the inks onto plain paper.)
(Warning, and I know this didn't enter into your question: It isn't Alpha-related.)
Yeah, but... (almost) all comic artists have that same restriction. Maybe that's part of why he's said he wasn't ready?
I still think you're referring to the Fear Itself volume - when I say that, I only mean the one that sprang out of Fear Itself, the latest one, which you're describing. That's the volume where Heather shot her cousin.
I'm sure it is volume 4, but I think of it as 5. Because my mind happens that way.
~ Le Messor
"Fear knocked at my door. Faith opened that door and no one was there."
~ Author Unknown
Yeah, Fear Itself is Volume 4, though I can understand you classing it as 5 if you include Omega Flight. (Which I actually reckon would have changed it's name to become Alpha Flight eventually, had it 'stayed' an ongoing.)
I'm assuming that Garry is referring to the fear itself as volume 4, he is just refusing to address it as fear itself because he hates that arc so much he doesn't think it deserves to be known by its proper name. And as far as character assassinations go, the only two I think come anywhere near that charge are Vindicator and Sasquatch. barring the ending where he lets his brainwashed wife flee with his only child, Mac was as Mac as he'd always been. puck was Puck, Northstar and Aurora were on point, Marrina was tweaked a bit to be more punk rocker in attitude, but I didnt mind that. Now Vindicators I agree was particularly off. The implication throughout, seemed to be that Heather willingly turned her self over to the Master because she wanted Claire back so much, and that the brainwashing element of unity just turned her anger up to eleven. That means according to the writers Heather was willingly able to send Canada to its doom solely so she could save Claire.....from a stable and loving home. I don't care how much Heather was distraught over not getting Claire back, she would never have listened to the Master, ever.Now if they had Unbrainwashed her and had her have a Michael pointer moment where she relives the moment of killing her cousins and is in utter horror from what she did, I could see the damage done to her character lessened somewhat. But nope, we get a fake feel good moment with no mention of her cousins ever again. The only problem I had with Sasquatch was that out of nowhere near the end they gave him a duality crisis like the hulk. Now in the original Byrne run there was that battle for control between him and Tarnaq, but he never went hulk smash let alone actually say the phrase quatch smash.
I think what we've got here is failure to communicate!
But it's cleared up now. :)
Tha's cool, but for me I'd also say Marinna (turned from a sweet innocent girl into an angry nasty punk rocker) and Shaman (turned into an angry minority). Oh, and the comic Alpha Flight (as opposed to the team itself); turned wayyyy angry.
I dunno about Garry, but that tone of anger was the biggest problem I had with v4. (Yep, adopting the proper name now. For as long as I remember...)
~ Le Messor
"If you are patient in one moment of anger, you will escape a hundred days of sorrow."
~ Chinese Proverb
Il be completely honest...... I disagree completely about the anger. Outside of heather I didn't think anyone was unusually angry from the alpha flight cast. And also Their country just turned into a dystopia overnight, and had a longtime friend in heather betray them. I'd be angry too. Two things about marinna: 1. People can be punk rockers without being angry, I saw her more as sarcastic than angry. And 2. That homegirl charm is still present as seen when Kyle and Northstar embrace and she goes awwwww.
I started thinking about how ironic (or just plain hypocritical!) it'd be if I started an angry fight* about this! :D
You make a subtle distinction about Marinna; since I haven't read the comics since they first came out, I really can't address it.
* I was never thinking about starting said fight.
~ Le Messor
"For an actress to be a success she must have the face of Venus, the brains of Minerva, the grace of Terpsichore, the memory of Macaulay, the figure of Juno, and the hide of a rhinoceros."
~ Ethel Barrymore
Issue one of fear itself was the first alpha flight issue I ever read, although ironically it was the last alpha flight arc I completed. The reason I guess why Marrina was so jarring is that, correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the last time prior to issue 1 of fear itself where she was present was way back when Alpha flight invaded Atlantis? Cuz I can see going from that to die earth scum being offsetting to people. Personally,as a punk rocker myself, I liked it, but then again I also liked her before that change. Now in terms of character advancement I thought volume 4 did the best ever interpretation of Aurora and Northstar out of the entire history of Alpha Flight ( I probably just violated the Ten Commandments of John Byrne with that statement )
Technically, Marinna appeared in an issue of New Avengers, but that was in the background in a bakti tank. Also in several issues of Avengers right after the Atlantis invasion you speak of.
People have given a lot of reasons for the change; me, I don't care. I care that I liked her a lot more before it than after; and that, as a reader, it came from nowhere. We'd seen her being the sweet, innocent version, then she was the punk. Iirc, the characters didn't even acknowledge there was a change.
(Note: I'm not saying I disliked her after; just that she wasn't the same character, and for me that was not an improvement.)
And that's fair to each their own. I've seen both versions and liked the second one better, just because we came out with different conclusions doesn't make either of us wrong. And as far as writers go, I only feel one writer 100 percent missed the boat on what Alpha Flight should be about and that's Lobdell. He turned the characters into walking jokes. We can Debate whether obeck and van lente made the series too "angry" but at least they didn't turn our beloved band into parodies and caricatures.
I can respect that. What volume 4 vividly portrayed is Vindicator (with Dept. H goons in tow, surrounding the house) bursting into the cousins' home, with the express intention of getting Claire back...and already had a report made up to indicate the cousins had weapons, which Mr. Eaglesham clearly illustrated they did not have. Moreover, when Vindicator gets back to HQ, she lets a Wendigo poke her daughter...this is not an example of good mothering, IMHO.What vol. 4 also vividly portrays is Mac/Guardian leading Judd, Aurora, and Snowbird on a bank-robbery. Bank surveillance picks up the events; Cody broadcasts the events...it clearly says so later in the story. Judd, Aurora, and Snowbird are direct accomplices to a felony (I'm assuming grand theft larceny is a felony in Canada), and there is no illustration or exposition that exonerates either Vindicator or Mac/Guardian from what they did.Because, if Cody was legally elected to be PM in AF's fictional world, than leading an armed revolt against Cody's UNITY regime---regardless of how overreaching and abusive it was---still constitutes sedition...which the whole team was instrumental in. Cody, presumably, died when the spacecraft leveled Parliament Hill, so who's left that knows/saw The Master outside of Mac, Heather, baby Claire and the member(s) of STRIKE TEAM ALPHA who just disappeared by the end of # 8?Lastly, in the footage of AF breaking out of the UNITY stronghold, it shows a brown Sasquatch...at the time when Walter couldn't transform into Sasquatch. Sure, Snowbird transforms into a Sasquatchy beast, but she goes albino/white when she transforms.
I'm less worried about the (616) public perception of the team than I am the things they actually did and why.
Running around robbing banks? Not heroic. Even if you're whacked-out on Scooby snacks.
Sedition? Revolution? Depends on who you're rebelling against. Just saying you want a revolution isn't bad in and of itself - we all want to change the world.
The book, however, didn't do enough for me to set up the evilness of the government. They kept saying 'Mind control! Mind control!' - after a while, I started asking: 'So? What's the mind control for?' because the mind control is the tool, not the ends. As much as I don't like the idea of it, they needed more than that to set up the evil. (There was a throwaway line in the final issue about taking over the galaxy; too little, too late.)
Heather's actions - mitigated by mind control. But the writer wasn't.
~ Le Messor
"Gandhi had a sign reading: When you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper; and when you are in the wrong, you cannot afford to lose it."
~ Chester Bowles
Mr. Surviving-fictional-Canadian-high-ranking official, in the aftermath of the alien spacecraft that leveled Parliament Hill, who are Canada's premier protectors? Vindicator? Guardian? Who will defend the Great White North if a Great Beast shows up? Snowbird? Sasquatch? Shaman? Who can we depend on if more Plodex/Skrulls/under-sea barbarians come back? Aurora? Northstar? Marrina?
Well as the ending showed, it was clearly overtly by the second to last page, saying that guardian, Sasquatch, aurora, North Star, Puck, Marrina, Shaman, and Snowbird would be the sanctioned alpha flight, while vindicator went off to raise Claire on her own. Yes it was never said in a word balloon, but the full page spread of that team seemed to indicate that would be the case.
I'll also be perfectly frank, I disagree with the limits your placing on the masters power, as I feel he does have that power to pull off, , particulalrly when you remember the immense fear the world was covered in from that asgardian serpent would have helped sway a fearful nation towards a fear monger like Gary Cody. I'd say more but a.) outside of the heather murdering her cousins and no remorse I have zero venom towards this series, so simply reading why others hate It is simply dissuading me from continuing to take part in this particular thread and b. I found out my essay is due five days earlier than when I initially thought so I can't procrastinate any longer!
Even if what you say is true, what's the name used in Captain Marvel's new book? Even if what you say is true, were any members of the team formerly known as Alpha Flight exonerated, either by the Governor General or the new PM? Even if what you say is true, it isn't unreasonable to infer that what they did makes it difficult for an official to make an overt declaration that Guardian, Vindicator, Aurora, Northstar (!), Puck, Sasquatch, Snowbird, Shaman, and Marrina are still Canada's sanctioned/premier super-heroes. I'll miss ya.
I think that was more a metaphor and a traditional super-hero splash page than a direct nod to any sanctioning.
however...
They were back working for the Government in Red Hulk:Mayan Rule (which is set straight after Vol.4), and then in Amazing X-Men:World War Wendigo. Also, they were free to go to the US to attend Northstar & Kyle's wedding in between the above two storylines.
So chances are they were exonerated.
However however... On the other hand.... - the Government did restart Omega Flight and send them to deal with the Garden Origin Site infestation in Avengers, rather than Alpha Flight....
FULL DISCLOSURE: I do not have Red Hulk: Mayan Rule, Amazing X-Men: World War Wendigo, or Northstar & Kyle's wedding.
Even if I had the money, if Alpha Flight volume 4 couldn't bother to tell what happened to 1 Wendigo(, Ranark, and an adamantium terrorist), why should I think that there's going to be a resolution with a whole army of Wendigoes?
Whenever a new AF series comes out, there's a big frenzy to buy lots and lots of copies so it will sell well and be popular and give the characters lots of exposure and show MARVEL that AF has a solid group of supporters. And then, when the readers who actually care about the group cut back from buying umpteen copies of the same thing, the powers that be claim that the readership is dwindling, that AF doesn't have devoted supports, and the team isn't viable. I'm tired of playing that game.
I'm genuinely interested as to why you think it's a case of they couldn't be bothered?
Life doesn't have perfect wrapped up stories, so why does fiction have to?
Not everything has to be explained and tied up in a bow; things take priority - especially when governed by profit/loss.
Especially in an ongoing comic universe where the story is never over.
I mentioned RH:MR and AX:WWW as these continued the story and actually answered your question as to government status.
There's only a frenzy if you choose there to be one.Quote:
Whenever a new AF series comes out, there's a big frenzy to buy lots and lots of copies so it will sell well and be popular and give the characters lots of exposure and show MARVEL that AF has a solid group of supporters.
Where your own money is concerned you should never be manipulated!
There's the problem then; people shouldn't buy more than one copy - that's clearly just creating a house of false statistics that inevitably comes tumbling down, proving Marvel right.Quote:
And then, when the readers who actually care about the group cut back from buying umpteen copies of the same thing, the powers that be claim that the readership is dwindling, that AF doesn't have devoted supports, and the team isn't viable. I'm tired of playing that game.
And that's fine, don't play the game - I fully, fully support your decision and completely agree with it; if you don't enjoy something, don't pay money for it.
However, just because you personally don't like something, it doesn't mean that it was bad.
Personally I think Volume 4 was far truer to Byrne than 2&3. And nowhere near 'demolishing' or 'character assassinating'
You say you'd 'rather come up with a storyline you know you'd like' - what's to say that anyone else would like it?
I'm sure Pak & Van Lente liked their storyline.
All this is very much off-topic though; I'm interested to see your vision of the team, and hopefully I will like it!
Which reminds me, I'm getting an edition of world war wendigo trade on loan from my schools library so il let you know what I think. And Garry, you say you don't hate it, then fine you don't hate it, I mispoke. but to be fair, that makes me utterly terrified to read your review of mantalo or something else that you actually hated. I don't nessecairly like mantalo (after hobnell he was the weakest of the volume 1 writers) and their are many decisions he made I utterly hated ( creating persuasion, making heather care more about her boy toy then she did the rest of the team post bedlam, the utter insanity of having the dreamqueen and sorceror arcs occur right after each other with no time to breathe etc) but their were storylines and arcs I did like (the pestilence arc (I know controversial opinion) the puck Tibet two parter, Revamping box from Bochs to Jefferies, etc) and I'd rather not get angry reading your opinions on those. As much as you don't hate volume 4, the way you wrote about came off to me as unfair in many places and I'm only going to assume that my perception won't change reading your opinion on something you legitimately hate. Your welcome to your opinions, I just will choose not to read them from here on in. Best of luck to you though.