Alpha Flight Vol. 2

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06-26-2004
SwiftFox

Alpha Flight Vol. 2

Okay, I know VOlume 2 had a lot of issues.... but well.. it's Alpha Flight, so I picked up the whole set off Ebay. Not too shabby in addition to issues 1-20, I got the -1 Flashback issue, The annual and TWO extra copies of issue 2, and they have a different cover than the standard one.

Anyways... I've read through a few issues now (finally got to read issue 1!) I still have a lot to go through... but... we nevr found out who Scorpio was did we? It says something about him having once been a hero....
06-26-2004
Phil

Re: Alpha Flight Vol. 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwiftFox

and TWO extra copies of issue 2, and they have a different cover than the standard one.

So 2 covers in total yeah?

Quote:

but... we nevr found out who Scorpio was did we? It says something about him having once been a hero....

Nope, never found out and probably never will since he and the rest of that Zodiac group were seemingly killed in Weapon X #1.
06-26-2004
SwiftFox

Re: Alpha Flight Vol. 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil

So 2 covers in total yeah?

Right. 3 copies, 2 different covers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil

Nope, never found out and probably never will since he and the rest of that Zodiac group were seemingly killed in Weapon X #1.

Awwww that sucks... hate to have teasy little mysteries like that.

Another one I noticed was that Lili was 'familiar' to Diamond Lil... and her power had to to with body density... and the Hull House kids were called 'legacies'.... could they have been made from other Alphans... (Going on the idea that has been mentioned before of Adrian being Jeffries kid...
06-26-2004
Zach

Hmm, I never even thought about Jeffries as Adrien's father. I always guessed it was Colossus. They have just about the exact same power, so I just assumed.
06-26-2004
kozzi24

I remember reading somewhere that Seagle intended him to be Wolverine's kid. Madison Jeffries as father always made more sense to me, although I didn't think they had fathers per se, but were bioengineered from templates of the original Alphas. Almost all their powers were redundant to the powers of other Alphas
06-27-2004
bigbloo

Quote:

Originally Posted by kozzi24

I remember reading somewhere that Seagle intended him to be Wolverine's kid. Madison Jeffries as father always made more sense to me, although I didn't think they had fathers per se, but were bioengineered from templates of the original Alphas. Almost all their powers were redundant to the powers of other Alphas

So Flex = Wolvie
Radius = Unus (not an alphan)
Ghost Girl = Diamond Lil
Murmur = Purpllee Girl/Persuasion
Flinch = Northstar? (super reflexes)
Ouija = Shaman?
06-27-2004
beetleblack

Re: Alpha Flight Vol. 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwiftFox

Another one I noticed was that Lili was 'familiar' to Diamond Lil... and her power had to to with body density... and the Hull House kids were called 'legacies'.... could they have been made from other Alphans... (Going on the idea that has been mentioned before of Adrian being Jeffries kid...

Cripes, I'd forgotten about the whole Lil and Lily thing until you mentioned it. Sadly there were a lot of questions left unanswered at the end of the run. We didn't even know how Diamond Lil was (at one point I thought we were never going to find her at all!). Also why didn't AF try and go and rescue Jefferies from Zodiac??? Weapon X seemed to do it so easily. Also we never found out the connection between Scorpio and Department H. Of course, Diamond Lil is actually a prisoner of Weapon X too, I think.

Another thing which intrigued me was the whole Virgo story which I thought was going to have more relevance that it eventually did. It was like Seagle was going somewhere with it and then had to suddenly go in a different direction.
06-27-2004
SwiftFox

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbloo

So Flex = Wolvie

I still don't see that, adamantium is an additive to Wolvie, not a power. His power is his healing factor. (I don't know how they explained off the bone claws.... secondary mutation or something?) But even that is a far far stretch to Flex's abilities, the other ones all have a more direct similarity at least. (except flich... who KNOWS what he does?? Other than smell....)

Thats why to me Maddy makes more sense, at least his powers have a conenction to metal...

Ahhhh... who knows?
06-27-2004
SwiftFox

Re: Alpha Flight Vol. 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by beetleblack

Diamond Lil is actually a prisoner of Weapon X too, I think.

I believe they might have killed her... I think I've seen it mentioned. Don't read the title myself.... so who knows?

Quote:

Originally Posted by beetleblack

Another thing which intrigued me was the whole Virgo story which I thought was going to have more relevance that it eventually did. It was like Seagle was going somewhere with it and then had to suddenly go in a different direction.

Yeah, you're right... she goes to Paris.... stays there a few weeks... Taurus teleports in, they both port out.... like uh... what was the point? Except that they took Maddy in retribution for Virgo disappearing...
06-27-2004
beetleblack

Re: Virgo

When I originally read the issue with Virgo arriving in Paris I hadn't read the previous issues but I was suitably intrigued by the character, I even half thought that she might end up joining AF! Glad to know that I'm not the only one who thought the whole plot was a little odd and pointless in the end. I just remember that some mystery was put upon it and they even put this story thread in the 'Previously in Alpha Flight...' section therefore giving it even more relevance that it didn't deserve. It was like some big mystery that Virgo just vanished like that when she was meant to be a teleporter anyway. Oh well, maybe one day Seagle will reveal his original plans for vol. 2.

As for Diamond Lil and her demise, apparently the rumours of her death have been greatly exagerated... well kinda. In an issue of Weapon X she is seen supposedly beaten to a pulp, and readers assumed dead (we only know it was here because she was wearing that hideous green and yellow diamond outfit btw, but that's by the by) however the writer later revealed that she was no dead, not sure if she's been seen since or not.

And as for who parented the children of Hull House, I like kozzi and bigbloo's idea best and it even makes better sense.
06-27-2004
SwiftFox

Quote:

Originally Posted by beetleblack

RE: Virgo
When I originally read the issue with Virgo arriving in Paris I hadn't read the previous issues but I was suitably intrigued by the character, I even half thought that she might end up joining AF! Glad to know that I'm not the only one who thought the whole plot was a little odd and pointless in the end. I just remember that some mystery was put upon it and they even put this story thread in the 'Previously in Alpha Flight...' section therefore giving it even more relevance that it didn't deserve. It was like some big mystery that Virgo just vanished like that when she was meant to be a teleporter anyway. Oh well, maybe one day Seagle will reveal his original plans for vol. 2.

I hadn't read Issue either (until yesterday) when she is 'sent' to Paris....
A reader brought up in the letters page of ish 7, that it took her until issue 5 to appear in Paris.... bloody slow teleporting... The reply to the letter said "Perhaps Virgo's delayed appearance isn't necessarily due to her own power. Check out Alpha #1 again and look at the last words spoken to her."
The last thing said to her was Paris... (which doesn't seem like much of a command to me...) how does that make her fade away and then appear in Paris quite a while later??? *sigh* I wish they wrapped up all the actual story with issue 19 and used 20 just to show some art and create a list of explanations for everything...
06-27-2004
Weapon Omega

In my opinion, Marvel cut off Volume 2 a little too soon. I agree, there's a lot of plots and subplots that needed to be resolved. The big one for me is, what did the Zodiac steal the Nth projector for? And what does the Nth projector do?? Any info would be appreciated, thanks.
06-27-2004
beetleblack

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwiftFox

A reader brought up in the letters page of ish 7, that it took her until issue 5 to appear in Paris.... bloody slow teleporting... The reply to the letter said "Perhaps Virgo's delayed appearance isn't necessarily due to her own power. Check out Alpha #1 again and look at the last words spoken to her."
The last thing said to her was Paris... (which doesn't seem like much of a command to me...) how does that make her fade away and then appear in Paris quite a while later???

Maybe she went to Paris, Texas by mistake and realised she had to be else where? Although why did she arrive in such a confused state??? I think we're meant to think that something else is/was going on and something happened to her between teleporting and arriving in Paris. I like to think that maybe she was waylaid in LiveWorld along the way and this may have built up to another Dream Queen story... although as the mystical side of things was pretty much down played in vol 2 this is purely my own conjecture.

As for the Nth Projector, it looks like that with the Zodiac currently out of action thanks to Weapon X, we will probably never know. Oh and if Weapon X could easily track down where the Zodiac were hanging out and rescue Mr Jefferies why couldn't Department H/AF do the same??? It's like AF just didn't care at all - they rarely mentioned Mr Jefferies at all! I know that Heather and Puck were brainwashed, but even after that you would have thought they might have tried to track down the Zodiac and grab Jefferies back somehow! Also, we know that the corrupt Dept H (pre-Gentry) were somehow in cohoots with the Zodiac but how come this link was never uncovered after Gentry took over? That would surely have made it easier to rescue Jefferies.
06-28-2004
kozzi24

With an organization like Dept H, a connection to Zodiac doesn't have to be official. For those who want an answer to the question, assume Clark was a member of or secret leader of Zodiac and the Dept H/Zodiac connection died with him. Make out Clark as a Bastion or Gyricj wannabe, amassing centers of superhuman power for his own ends.

Due to the brainwashing, Heather and Puck don't remember Madison even being around. In the blame it on the now-dead Clark game, Clark made no official record of Madison's involvement in the "new" Alpha or subsequent capture by Zodiac because it would have been contrary to is purposes.

Look at Diamond Lil's involvement in Weapon X as a complete dismantling of the prisoner subbasesments.
06-28-2004
bigbloo

Quote:

Originally Posted by kozzi24

Look at Diamond Lil's involvement in Weapon X as a complete dismantling of the prisoner subbasesments.

Is the Weapon X program tied to Department H? They could have just turned over all their mutant prisoners, or, Weapon X could have "retrieved" the subbasement prisoners.

That would mean Weapon X also has WoodGod and the rest of Beta in Wonderland... or had. Um, whats the latest on the mutant concentration camp anyway? I dont really read Weapon X...
06-28-2004
kozzi24

It's definitely worth the read, or maybe I share too much wavelength with Tieri. I hated Phantomex from his first appearance, so am very happy with the latest issue. I started reading it as an Alpha title, but consider it on its own now.

The War of the Programs arc explored some of the links, but I don't know about any direct connection between H and X.
06-28-2004
DelBubs

In Deadpool/Death 98, you have one panel of Mac flying over a Weapon X facility, dialogue gives the impression that the inmates of the facility, with application and training could contribute like Mac had. I've always took this as either Dept H(upper echelon) or Dept K played some part in the Weapon X program.

In regards to Neverland (mutant concentration camp), it would seem to be deserted and the inmates gone. The Weapon X prog would seem to have gone underground, so Weapon Plus is now the official prog and in direct conflict with X.

Or somthing like that.
06-29-2004
Phil

Re: Alpha Flight Vol. 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwiftFox

Quote:

Originally Posted by beetleblack

Diamond Lil is actually a prisoner of Weapon X too, I think.

I believe they might have killed her... I think I've seen it mentioned. Don't read the title myself.... so who knows?

She's alive. Still held captive, but alive.
06-29-2004
beetleblack

Re: Alpha Flight Vol. 2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwiftFox

Quote:

Originally Posted by beetleblack

Diamond Lil is actually a prisoner of Weapon X too, I think.

I believe they might have killed her... I think I've seen it mentioned. Don't read the title myself.... so who knows?

She's alive. Still held captive, but alive.

That poor woman, she's not had the best of luck over the last few years has she? Firstly she's a prisoner of Dept H having all manner of nasty experiments on her, then she ends up a prisoner of Weapon X! And if that weren't bad enough the last time we saw her she was wearing that awful green/yellow diamond costume which is UGLY! I say we start a campaign to FREE DIAMOND LIL - NOW!
07-18-2004
kozzi24

With how specific Tieri was about Lil being alive, I think he's got plans for her reunion with her hubby.