Showing the Omega Fight slide, Rosemann asked, "Has Sasquatch ever looked so cool?" To which Quesada fired back, "He's never looked cool."
Way to sell your product. fool.
Newsarama.com
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Showing the Omega Fight slide, Rosemann asked, "Has Sasquatch ever looked so cool?" To which Quesada fired back, "He's never looked cool."
Way to sell your product. fool.
Newsarama.com
I don't knwo I feel that may be taken out of context, I don't knwo jsut doesn't seem like some one would say it in the way it is portreyed
no, i read it. joe q needs to refine his stand up act on his off duty time. he meant it as a joke, it just came off well..........dumb.
i mean, if this is how tptb promote new titles at marvel, then its no wonder all that succeeds at marvel are x-titles, spiderman and avengers.
tom b rants, joe q performs stand up.
who knows.. its just so strange to see a company acting like this it just seems to try and be funny but come off rude-ish
Read it...Didn't find it funny. Can I call him Joke now, Phil?
Dana :P
Yeah, I saw that at Newsarama. Seriously not impressed, especially when thats the only Omega Flight comment that makes into the article.
Insulting all the artists who've ever drawn Sasquatch in the past just screams "no class" but I get that vibe from everything I read from the man.
What got me was less his comment, more on what he DIDN'T say. Joe Q is the Ultimate salesman at heart. You ask him about Big Hero Six and he'll spin how he has big plans for the future, it's the book not to miss, it'll change people's lives after you read it, blah blah blah. And this is all he says about OF.
I could expect something like "Has Sasquatch ever looked so cool?", "Personally I though he never looked cool [laughs], but now, in this new series written by Mike Oeming and drawn with the artistic talents of Scott Kolins, NO ONE will ever be able to say that again!! Don't believe me? Read the book once April comes around to find out True Believer!!"
You know what I mean? Fine make a joke, but don't end there! Otherwise your not helping but adding to the joke factor AF has gotten in recent years.
Not so. We can't just single out what Joe said without remembering that Bill Rosemann also said "Has Sasquatch ever looked so cool?" while displaying Omega art to a packed room of people. He also talked up the lead-in via Ms. Marvel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Corvus
Honestly? It was probably just Joe joking around with Rosemann and I'm sure that live it came off as a joke. Whether it seems funny in an online recap is sort of irrelevant.
I think we're overreacting a bit. If Marvel really didn't want to support the book in any way, they wouldn't have included it in their panel, plain and simple. Marvel might not be going as far as we'd like in promoting it, but it's silly to think they're intentionally trying to harm it. That just makes no sense.
To follow up what I just posted, there was more Omega content that Newsarama didn't post about. This is from CBR's coverage
...and just to prove that Joe's making stupid jokes at every book's expense:Quote:
Now that there’s an army of superheroes, how will over countries respond? “New Avengers: the Initiative,” according to Dan Slott. Quesada pointed out Canada’s super-team Omega Flight as another example.
...
Michael Oeming said “Omega Flight” is an interesting idea Millar had earlier in "Civil War" planning. One good thing for him is that “the characters we have are pretty blank slates.” Expect character moments in the book. “There’ll be lots of superhero fighting, stuff blows up, but that doesn’t matter if you don’t have characters you can care about.”
Sorry, I just can't read his jokes as malice. It makes no sense.Quote:
Over in “New Avengers”, McCann said “there’s something brewing in ‘New Avengers.’” Quesada quipped “I think it’s just gas.”
yeah, and lets not forget joe spent the better part of a year saying that speedball was the worse hero marvel ever created.
I jsut think after the downgrade to a mini everyone is looking for marvel to be after them, so the blog, this... its just examples of stuff we look into and go "is this why they downgraded it? cause they hate us?"
I just don't see how the "woe is us" persecution complex is going to help this book at all.
At the end of the day there's a finite group of us and no matter how much negativity we spew at Marvel it's not going to make a difference. Nobody's going to say "oh the 200 Alpha Flight internet regulars are mad, we better rethink our publishing strategy." What we need to do is get people who might not otherwise read the book excited about it, and being so consistently downtrodden about everything isn't going to do that.
Good point.
Hopefully, we'll get some OF images from Oeming at the con. Or something.
BTW, rumour has it that NotOld New Warriors is a mini, but just a rumour.
wonder if champions will be a mini?
I have friends who have been readign some of my Alpha flights and i've asked them to buy omega flights instead of jsut reading mien in hoeps that it helps
Nope, it's a maxi.Quote:
Originally Posted by varo
http://marvel.com/news/comicstories.479Quote:
As announced at the Civil War: The Initiative panel at New York Comic Con, the July-launching 12-issue maxi-series by Matt Fraction and Barry Kitson...
Unless you count the fact that 90% of readers are ONLY going to get the online recap.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
The 'it's just gas' comment didn't undermine New Avengers in any way. Meaning, nothing in that comment can be read as 'New Avengers is bad'. 'Sasquatch never looked cool' can only be read as negative. Even in joking.
Do you see the distinction?
- Le Messor
"Dangling prepositions is something up with which I will not put."
Well, new New Warriors is an ongoing...
NRAMA: Also, last week spoke New Warriors was slated as an ongoing, but since that time, another post-Civil War launch Omega Flight was changed from an ongoing to (at least initially) a limited series. One can find a fair amount of similarities between Alpha Flight and the New Warriors. They’re both concepts that had a popular initial runs and garnered loyal cult followings based on those early years, but since then neither have been able to sustain attempts to relaunch.
So first all, what’s your series current status, ongoing or limited series?
KG: The series is definitely an ongoing. I have a lot of cool things planned.
http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=102799
I certainly do...Joe's constant potshots at AF/AF characters and Tom Brevoort's less-than-pleasant comments about the AF community are getting really tiresome. Quesada has shown very little to no respect for Alpha Flight/AF's creator or AF fans. I don't see a man just making jokes...I see somebody who feels/thinks Alpha Flight is a big joke (a team filled with lame heroes from Canada, who really don't deserve to have an on-going series) and isn't willing to let us forget it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Messor
I'm sure Joe would be very happy to never hear anything about Alpha Flight again (hence the name-change and shoe-horning of non-Canadian characters into the book).
Dana
GAWD!....Of course neither AF or NW relaunches have been able to make it...They just don't get it, do they? They keep giving us stand-ins for the real thing or watered-down AF/NW concepts or "funny books"...Cripes!Quote:
Originally Posted by Canucklehead
Dana
:x
Sure, but I also think it's unreasonable to expect a group of creators talking up their products to a room full of fans to stop and deliberate every single sentence and flippant remark in an effort to prevent people on the internet from picking one out of context and misconstruing it. To expect Joe et all to only speak in bullet-proof one-sentence sound bytes that are guaranteed not to offend is unrealistic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Messor
We're making a mountain out of a molehill, and as I said earlier regardless of what Joe actually meant we're not going to complain this book into existence.
Dana I'm sorry to harp on this, but this has devolved into fantasy.Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrkoenig67
Who entertained proposals for Omega?
Who greenlit the series?
Who chatted it up in his weekly online interviews?
Who pushed previews of the art out to fans in the company's most read online outlets?
Who talking about it in his NYCC panels?
Who agreed to work all this Alpha-related stuff into the company's big Civil War / Initiative push?
Joe.
Yes, he also looked at the market and decided to downgrade it to a mini, but that's part of his job.
While that decision hurts, for us to paint him as some mustache-twirling evil that we need to fight against is purely fantasy on our part. It may make us feel better, but it has no grounding in reality. If he really didn't want Marvel publishing anything about Alpha at all you wouldn't see 1 issue let alone 5.
Do you really think that Joe hates this book so much that he purposely greenlit a series with the INTENT on using it to screw with the hardcore fans and ultimately crush their spirits? Really? You seriously think he has a personal vendetta against us so deep that it's worth wasting money and creator time on?
The fact of the matter is that whether Omega was greenlit as a 5 issue mini or a 10,000 issue epic, if the sales at the end of issue 5 arn't enough to warrant an issue 6 then it wouldn't happen one way or the other.
Quoted for truth.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
Well, the New New Warriors being an ongoing is a knock against the argument that Omega Flight was downgraded for economic reasons. Sounds like the downgrade was done for editorial reasons.
How many books have ever been downgraded from ongoings to minis like that? How many minis have been turned into ongoings? Not many, if any recently.
But their is a lot of momentum to Omega Flight already, though no comments from Marvel like "It's popular in the editors' offices" like Joe Q et al say about other titles. If Oeming/Kolins hit the high notes, Marvel will turn it into an ongoing.
I'm personally not making much out of anything, to be honest. I've already stated elsewhere that I've got no strong feelings about OF one way or the other.
It's the flawed logic that's got me answering these threads:
'a group of creators talking up their products' are exactly the type of people I'd expect to 'speak in bullet-proof one-sentence sound bytes'. I expect them to be making PREPARED statements with a view to PUBLICITY.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
These are people marketing a product.
Did the Coca Cola executives ever go on TV / newspapers / whatever and say "I personally think New Coke was never any good" while marketing it? I think not!
If we're mobbing against Joe Q right now, it's because he gave us the rope. I think knot.
When you're trying to bring a new product to the market, you don't undermine it in public. That's all I'm saying.
- Le Messor
"I only gave you the rope. You tied a clown to it."
- Michael J Fox, Spin City
In your opinion, not mine.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
You forgot he red-lighted an actual Alpha Flight Proposal from Millar, then green-lighted the OF proposal (he doesn't believe the original AF will work, yet has no proof it won't). He green-lighted an on-going, then canned that. He said AF fans would hate what happens and then love it? What was he referring to...Alpha's Death? Yes...we hated it...But will we love Omega? That is yet to be seen. Was Joe also the person that told Oeming, who stated in an interview that this would be Alpha's last chance...Implying that if Omega Flight fails, we'll never see AF again?Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
BTW...What "Alpha-related stuff" are you referring to in the Civil War/Initiative books? Do you mean Omega-related?
Yet New Warriors gets an on-going and the untried new "Champions" gets a Maxi? Downgrading a series from on-going to mini makes me a bit more worried about quality and content, more than it being a marketing issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
I never said he hated Omega Flight, nor that he was using it to crush Alpha Flight fans' spirits. I also didn't say that he had any sort of vendetta against us...Only that he's not very respectful of AF/AF's creator and the AF fan-community and that he treats AF like a joke. A lack of respect does not equal a vendetta. Joe certainly doesn't have faith enough in Omega to make the series an on-going. You mentioned us miscontruing things said by Quesada...You've just miscontrued most of what I said in my original post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
Big duh.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
Dana
[quote="cmdrkoenig67"]I'm equating the two, and maybe that's why we're splitting hairs with each other. For all intents and purposes Omega is Alpha for me, I'm taking Oeming's "Omega is the last chance for Alpha" comment at face value. If this tanks I honestly can't see them trying another Alpha-related series for years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
The point I've been trying to make (and I don't mean to have it aimed at you in particular) is that the negativity constant directed towards Marvel never leads to anything positive. Catharsis aside, it just seems like bitterness and that's not the best way for the community to help grow the audience for Alpha/Omega books.
I don't want to make drag this argument out anymore so I'll bow out of the next round.
Cheers.
[quote="Adam"]Were/are we arguing? We do disagree...And you misinterpreted most of what I had said...That exchange hardly qualifies as an argument. As for helping a fan-community grow? It takes more than one type of person to do that...Would you rather we be all clones?Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrkoenig67
I also equate Omega Flight with being Alpha Flight, Vol.4. Marvel folks (meaning both Oeming and Quesada) have flip-flopped on what exactly Omega Flight is...They have referred to it both as AF's last chance and also not being Alpha Flight. As another esteemed member here stated (I'm forgetting who, please forgive my terrible memory)...It's really unfair to leave Alpha Flight out of the equation, if indeed...It is their last chance.
Dana
We're probably not, that's just my own insecurity talking. I'm always worried I've offended someone (does that sound Canadian or what?).Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrkoenig67
I think that internally at Marvel Omega is regarded as Alpha Vol 4, and if it fails then "Alpha" will have another black mark against it. However since the perception exists that the market won't support a pure-Alpha book the outward face of it is that it's "not Alpha."Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrkoenig67
Let's just hope the Classic trade sells like hotcakes and shows that people really do love the originals.
I'll be buying it (Alpha Flight Classic), definitely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam
Dana
I was at said panel and I didn't personally interpret it as malicious.
But that's just me.
Oeming has never flip-flopped. He's always been clear on what this title was. He proposed a new Alpha Flight title, it was rejected, it was then that the idea for Omega Flight was created, since Marvel wouldn't go for a new AF title, Oeming decided to go for the next best thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrkoenig67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oeming
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaFlight.net Interview
We all seem to be putting our energy into the wrong issues by even commenting on this. Whether the context of Joe Q.'s comments was in jest or not is immaterial. If we sit around spending all of our energy bashing the powers that be at Marvel we'll get nowhere. We've gotta spread the Alpha/Omega word. Use your powers for good folks! I could personally care less what Joe Q., Mike Oeming, or anyone else thinks about Alpha Flight, its characters or its viability. I'm a fan and I'd like to see many more Alpha/Omega stories in the future, so I'll spend my time working toward making Omega Flight a success, whether it's a mini, one shot, maxi, or comic strip.
Um...Ben, your two quotes prove that he did "flip-flop" as to what Omega Flight is/was. He stated originally that this was Alpha Flight's last chance (as he said, this apparently comes from Bendis) and he later stated that Omega is something new and not really Alpha Flight (as we know it). I guess it could be thought of as both Alpha Flight and not Alpha Flight, in some ways.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben
...And don't forget, Mark Millar pitched an Alpha Flight proposal first or around the same time as Oeming...Both proposal's were rejected by Quesada.
Dana
I think you and me have both said that.Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrkoenig67
I could care less, too, because I care quite a bit about what the writer of the series thinks about Alpha and its characters.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnacle13
If he doesn't like them, he's not gonna do a good series. Not that he doesn't; nothing has made me believe that. I just think it's kinda relevant.
- Le Messor
NP: Heartless, by Heart
I could care less, too, because I care quite a bit about what the writer of the series thinks about Alpha and its characters.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnacle13
If he doesn't like them, he's not gonna do a good series. Not that he doesn't; nothing has made me believe that. I just think it's kinda relevant.
- Le Messor
NP: Heartless, by Heart[/quote]
Yeah for me that's more a question of his work ethic. I think you can not like certain characters and still make entertaining sotries about them. Sure it could suffer if his heart's not all there, which I don't believe is the case, but if he has strong story telling skills and wants to be a successful writer then he'll put his all into it whether he likes the team or not. The statement is more to point out that for me it doesn't matter who writes the series, or edits, or promotes. I'll be buying it if it is a good story. I'll support it since it's the closest I think I'll get to Alpha Flight in some time. More importantly the statementwas to reinforce that we've gotta get off the negative vibe and move forward with promoting this book.
Yes...it might be, unfornately...What's more unfortunate, is that some folks are content with just any old thing, rather than nothing...And that may hurt the prospect of getting Alpha Flight back at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnacle13
If it's a good series, then heck yes...We should support it, if it's not then...Well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnacle13
Dana :!:
Yeah I still have a bad taste in my mouth from Vol 3. I fthis one goes in that direction, I'll be keeping my money!Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrkoenig67
AF example: Byrne.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnacle13
AF counter-example: Nicieza
From what I know, that, at least, is something we don't have to worry about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnacle13
I've never been able to keep my money.
- Le Messor
"Check or savings?"
"Spendings."
- Me, after Kez, at every eftpos ever.