If you get the Marvel.com email - they had a spotlight on Alpha Flight!

[Phil]

Right, but the decisions behind creating these comics were made well before the quarantine. The current situation doesn't make the concept of a title planned a year ago a bad decision.
If you mean that putting out any comics right now is a bad decision, then I completely agree with you. I'm just unsure as why you focused on the "How To Read..." book.
But as Marvel have halted printing, and Diamond have halted distribution the comic won't be going out till this is over, anyway.

The comic hasn't even come out yet; you don't know they're an insult.
To someone who needs safespaces, a safespace isn't an insult.

My comment on middle age was on the perceived majority of the comic collector market.
This site alone no longer has any female members, or male members under, I'm estimating, 35.
But the female teenage market is huge; they buy manga, or trades, or digital copies, or self-published books, that most middle-aged males have no idea about.

So hang on, now you're saying you want variant covers and a speculator boom and bust?
I wouldn't even want 17 variant covers for an Alpha Flight relaunch.

That's all true on AF, but Mantlo did a lot worse to them (IMO).
They may not be decisions I agree with or like, but they are creative literary decisions in a world ruled by finance.

Straight out writing off three books that haven't even been published yet as bad decisions just seems bizarre to me.

They could turn out to be the greatest literary pieces ever written by mankind (unlikely I know, but exaggerating to prove a point; they may just be enjoyable. To someone if not me).
They could change a child's life.
They could just make Disney lots of dollars.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

The Kibblesmith promotional video states that the characters are named for insults as "a badge of honor." This isn't me talking out the side of my neck; it's in the video.Once again, you state that I've written off three books that I haven't read, but you don't address how kids (whom you state are the intended audience for "How to read comics the MARVEL way") are going to have either a comixology account or an Amazon account. And if parents are out of work and worried about paying the mortgage (or rent), groceries, car note, utilities, and other bills, spending money on New Warriors or Superman or America Chavez or Spiderman becomes a luxury.The quarantine is something that a lot of adjacent industries were aware of and could see the consequences and ramifications that were possible and actually came to pass. But one of the big two aren't nimble enough to see this coming? Are you kidding me?As for ALPHA FLIGHT, MARVEL owns it. From Goblyn to Guardian, MARVEL owns it. From Lionel Jeffries to Lou Sandler, Jr., MARVEL owns it. From ALPHA FLIGHT # 29 to # 66---and every other issue before and after---MARVEL owns it all.

[Phil]

But that just goes for what I was saying;
They've taken an insult or a slur and flipped it; it's no longer an insult and something they're proud of. To them it isn't an insult.

I have stated exactly how kids will read it, just not when.
The "How To Read.." book will exist for years after this quarantine.
The decision to make this book began years ago.
You were saying the book itself was a bad decision.
Not that the book in this climate was a bad decision.

And yes, kids have access to Amazon accounts, as do parents trying to homeschool and entertain their kids; what better than an educational comic?

Creating a comic book from conception to landing in a store takes a significant amount of time, the big two definitely could not predict this virus a year ago.

I'm confused as to how Marvel owning anything makes it a bad decision.

[Phil]

If you're saying Marvel publishing any comic in this climate is a bad idea, then I agree.
But that goes for Immortal Hulk, Hellions and X-Factor; none of which I'll be able to get because they won't be shipping here during all this.

If you're singling out those three/four comics, then I'm confused.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

But they haven't "flipped it" from an insult or slur...or do you have the book to back up such a specious assertation?If kids have access to Amazon accounts, than it's all gravy and no worries for MARVEL.Certain retailers were uneasy as things started shutting down (within the last few weeks), but more importantly they've known how precarious having one distributor is FOR YEARS.Who said MARVEL owning ALPHA FLIGHT is a bad idea? I just stated that MARVEL owns it, that's all.

[Le Messor]

To sum up:
These are hard time for comics retailers (and everybody else).
Nobody could have seen that coming.
Some comics have problems from the start.
We can't know if any particular series is one of those before we've read it.
Some recently-announced comics look bad on the surface to some.
Others might enjoy those comics.

There's a difference between a bad marketing decision and a bad creative decision.

Please, let's stop arguing.
(On the other hand, this thread is getting more hits than all the other threads combined, so…)

~ Le Messor
"Stop all the fighting"
~ Freddie Mercury

[Phil]

If they're wearing it as a badge of honour then they've flipped it.
"Badge of honour" being the writer's words, as quoted by you.

I absolutely, 100%, totally, completely and utterly agree with you that having one distributor and an archaic pre-order system that can destroy stores is an absolute problem. I'm not debating that in the slightest.
I also agree that this quarantine could completely destroy the bricks and mortar industry as we know it.
Are these particular books that you've singled out solely responsible for that? No.

As to your AF point, I apologize then; I failed to understand why you brought up the ownership in this context, and discussion Bout bad decisions.

I understand books not being to people's tastes.
I would get it if you were to say you don't like the look of the series', or you wouldn't buy them, or you won't be surprised if they get cancelled - Hell; I won't be buying them.

I just didn't see how anyone, and that's anyone generally, as I'd have asked my original question to anyone, can with complete courage of conviction, categorically state that these are bad decisions without any ground.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

No. Just because you say they've flipped it, doesn't mean they've flipped it. You saying they've flipped it with no proof definitely doesn't mean they've flipped it.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

Watch the Kibblesmith video. Hear what he says. You don't have to take my word for it.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

Please see the YT video that superimposes the release of the Kibblesmith promotional video with the letters of two comic shop owners having to shut permanently.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

Please see the numbers for the last issue of the previous America Chavez series.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

And the original question did not differentiate between a bad marketing decision and a bad creative decision.

[Phil]

2) The exact quotes from the trailer, which I had already seen:
"A lot of the names are about teens fighting the labels that are put on them."
"They don't see as derogatory, to take take those words and wear them as badges of honour."
If that's not flipping something, I don't know what is.

3) I can't find the specific video you refer to, but realise there are lots of 'outrage' videos, again, all from people who haven't read the comic. Because no one outside of Marvel has.
I'm at a loss as to how a comic that hasn't even come out can cause two stores to close.

4) America #1 March 2017 = 43,592 physical sales to Diamond Comic Speciality stores + Subscription copies + Digital copies + Trade paperbacks
So, made a profit. Ergo good decision.
Plus, completely different creative team on this run;
A five issue limited series of a character who is about to be used in the Marvel Cinematic Universe.

5) If that's aimed at me, I know it didn't; Mik brought up the different between marketing and creative.

You think these are bad decisions, I disagree and was curious to know why.
As the proverbial cat, I regret being curious.

[Phil]

Anyway, an Admin has asked that I cease this, so I shall respect that.

For me, until CB Cebulski, Dan Buckley, Kevin Feige or Bob Chapek say they're bad decisions then I don't consider them to be.
They may not be decisions I like or agree with, but I can't say they're bad ones, because I'm not privy to what makes them good or bad.
Especially as I can't see into the future and judge books I haven't even read.
That was my only point.

If you, and everyone else in the world disagree then I'm happy to be in the minority.
If I'm proved wrong, then I'll hold my hands up and say I was wrong.

I may not agree with, or even understand, your thought process, but you're well within your rights to have it.
I'm sorry if any of my rebuttals gave the impression otherwise.

Thank you for the back and forth.

[Garry/Al-Fan]

By your own reasoning, without the comic book to prove your unfounded assertion, nothing has been flipped.