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Thread: Wolverine #304 (2012) - Return of an Alpha Flight member

  1. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by -k-m- View Post
    tricked out with the piercings, same look when he was an agent for romulous.

    yay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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  2. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil View Post
    I think I'm the only person who doesn't like Wolverine & The X-Men. I can see why a lot of people would, but for me it's just too goofy and disjointed. Like Aaron's trying to hard to recapture as many elements of past writers and fit his own voice in. But what do I know...
    You`re `probably`not the only one.

    I like WatXM, tho. Some of us on this site at one time or another have offered up the complain that comics are too dark nowadays; this combats that. I miss the days when comics were fun and enjoyable; I think it was X-Men that first started to ruin that for me, back in the late 80`s or so.
    Support Artists, Not Companies! Creator-owned comics are where the real art is at!

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  3. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Messor View Post
    I've just realised from the title of this thread that they've reset the numbering, too. For whatever that's worth.

    I haven't been reading Wolverine and The X-Men, but goofy sounds good to me... disjointed, not so much.

    - Le Messor
    "If this were subjunctive, I'm in the wrong mood."
    Disjointed; Lacking order or coherence.

    I`m thinking that word doesn`t fit. You don`t need to read any other X-titles to read and enjoy WatXM, I should know as it is almost the only Marvel title I purchase. It still tells stories that make sense, and in perfect order, from beginning to middle and through to the end.

    Coherence: a logical, orderly, and aesthetically consistent relationship of parts.

    Again, I`m not sure what would be considered disorderly about any of the issues I have read so far. Or illogical, evenm though it is clearly meant to be humourous it still makes sense, and it isn`t like it is out of continuancy or set in another universe or parallel dimension or anything. It just tells of the whacky goings-on at the Jean Grey School for Higher Learning!
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  4. #19
    Harvester of Sorrows Department H
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    It's starting to sound good to me.

  5. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flightpath07 View Post
    Disjointed; Lacking order or coherence.

    I`m thinking that word doesn`t fit. You don`t need to read any other X-titles to read and enjoy WatXM, I should know as it is almost the only Marvel title I purchase. It still tells stories that make sense, and in perfect order, from beginning to middle and through to the end.

    Coherence: a logical, orderly, and aesthetically consistent relationship of parts.

    Again, I`m not sure what would be considered disorderly about any of the issues I have read so far. Or illogical, evenm though it is clearly meant to be humourous it still makes sense, and it isn`t like it is out of continuancy or set in another universe or parallel dimension or anything. It just tells of the whacky goings-on at the Jean Grey School for Higher Learning!
    It's elements like the Bamf's, Krakatoa, Kid Gladiator all just being shoehorned in with no explanation, combined with almost 3 Stooges-esque humour, and Wolverine being portrayed as a caring headmaster in this book (and Avengers for that matter) whilst being a ruthless coldblooded killer in Uncanny X-Force. Then there's the extremely forced Kitty/Bobby thing, Toad being totally out of character, the completely jarring creative teams (Bachalo to Bradshaw), plus the upcoming AvX tie-ins.

    As I said, I get why people like it, I don't dislike it per se; It's just not a book for me.

  6. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil View Post
    It's elements like the Bamf's, Krakatoa, Kid Gladiator all just being shoehorned in with no explanation, combined with almost 3 Stooges-esque humour, and Wolverine being portrayed as a caring headmaster in this book (and Avengers for that matter) whilst being a ruthless coldblooded killer in Uncanny X-Force. Then there's the extremely forced Kitty/Bobby thing, Toad being totally out of character, the completely jarring creative teams (Bachalo to Bradshaw), plus the upcoming AvX tie-ins.

    As I said, I get why people like it, I don't dislike it per se; It's just not a book for me.
    Popular superhero comics have almost always been based around teenagers. Original X-Men were teenagers. And teams like X-Men have had many teenagers on them. FF always had teen-like angst, with the jokes and stuff between Johnny and Ben, and with Johnny being so immature. Spider-Man was the teen with the jokes, swinging through the city, one step ahead of the authoritative figure of J. Jonah Jamison.

    Comics about teens hit with a wide variety of audiences. Teens can relate, but so can adults as we have all been teens (and most of us, mentally, still feel like we ARE teens). Children can relate, as they are approaching (and looking up to) teenagers.

    This, to me, is a perfect setting; a school. It is silly, it is humorous. But, take away the super-powers, and it is a lot like real life. And that is what makes it work.

    As far as Wolvie the Headmaster not fitting with other people's versions of himself, I think this Wolverine was more taken from the popular and successful Wolverine and the X-Men animated series. In many ways, its a more adult (mature) and more reflective Wolverine, recognizing that he has to hand something down to the youth of the world, something more than just a body count. I like this version of Logan, and wish it were the ONLY one being used.

    To me, this is the Wolverine who would show up at Alpha Flight's funerals, rather than the Wolverine who forgot he even knew or cared about them until far afterward.
    Last edited by Flightpath07; 04-14-2012 at 02:26 AM.
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  7. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flightpath07 View Post
    You`re `probably`not the only one.

    I like WatXM, tho. Some of us on this site at one time or another have offered up the complain that comics are too dark nowadays; this combats that. I miss the days when comics were fun and enjoyable; I think it was X-Men that first started to ruin that for me, back in the late 80`s or so.
    I find that too many comics that try to get away from the cliched "darkness" of comics go way too far to the other end of the spectrum, and end up getting too goofy and silly. What seems to be lost these days is that nice middle ground...a fun, yet serious story that doesn't make you feel like taking a shower afterwards.

  8. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil View Post
    Toad being totally out of character,
    Toad has been out of character since the original X-Men movie came out in 2000.

  9. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flightpath07 View Post
    Popular superhero comics have almost always been based around teenagers. Original X-Men were teenagers. And teams like X-Men have had many teenagers on them. FF always had teen-like angst, with the jokes and stuff between Johnny and Ben, and with Johnny being so immature. Spider-Man was the teen with the jokes, swinging through the city, one step ahead of the authoritative figure of J. Jonah Jamison.
    I've got nothing against teenagers or fun in comics, I just don't feel that being 'fun' should be an excuse for sloppy writing - "Why did that just happen? Oh it doesn't matter because it's fun!" "Why are there all these Bamf's with no explanation or reason? Oh, people won't care because they're fun!"

    Comics about teens hit with a wide variety of audiences. Teens can relate, but so can adults as we have all been teens (and most of us, mentally, still feel like we ARE teens). Children can relate, as they are approaching (and looking up to) teenagers.
    Again, my issue was never about teenagers.

    This, to me, is a perfect setting; a school. It is silly, it is humorous. But, take away the super-powers, and it is a lot like real life. And that is what makes it work.
    That's fine, but you can have humourous and fun and real life AND good writing.
    That was what I liked about Byrne's AF - The Puck/Walt banter, and his FF - The Jonny/Ben banter, as you mentioned above.
    Fun, but made sense.

    But again, I seem to be the only person online who feels this way, so it's probably me.

    As far as Wolvie the Headmaster not fitting with other people's versions of himself, I think this Wolverine was more taken from the popular and successful Wolverine and the X-Men animated series.
    But its not though; it's direct 616 continuity straight out of Schism, and crosses over with Uncanny X-Force and AvX, hence the disjointed.

  10. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil View Post
    "Why are there all these Bamf's with no explanation or reason? Oh, people won't care because they're fun!"
    Ah, but one of the characters (can't offhand remember which one) asked about them too. I beleive it was Logan (?) who said he would explain later. Just because everything isn't explained upfront, doesn't mean necessarily that there is no good reason for it. As an aside, I really loved the (original) Nightcrawler limited series with the Bamfs and all that, it was one of the most fun series i have ever read, and I was proud to pass on my love of it ot my daughter.


    But again, I seem to be the only person online who feels this way, so it's probably me.
    I think you are too hard on yourself, sir! Just because we disagree, doesn't mean we cant be civil.

    Unless we are in a civil war, then we cant be civil, because that would just be silly.

    But its not though; it's direct 616 continuity straight out of Schism, and crosses over with Uncanny X-Force and AvX, hence the disjointed.
    IMHO, it is more disjointed for Wolverine to be on 16-hundred different super-teams.
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  11. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flightpath07 View Post
    Ah, but one of the characters (can't offhand remember which one) asked about them too. I beleive it was Logan (?) who said he would explain later. Just because everything isn't explained upfront, doesn't mean necessarily that there is no good reason for it.
    Well when it's explained I'll gladly eat my words and my hat

    I think you are too hard on yourself, sir! Just because we disagree, doesn't mean we cant be civil.
    Oh, not just here.
    I've been saying that for a while, as so far I haven't seen a bad review.

    IMHO, it is more disjointed for Wolverine to be on 16-hundred different super-teams.
    I agree, so giving him an extra title and role and team really isn't helping.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Eberly View Post
    I find that too many comics that try to get away from the cliched "darkness" of comics go way too far to the other end of the spectrum, and end up getting too goofy and silly.
    Generally, I agree with that issue - that people have too much binary thinking, and can never find a middle ground. But since I'd rather see a goofy silly comic than a too-serious one, I was a little iffy about that, until...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Eberly View Post
    What seems to be lost these days is that nice middle ground...a fun, yet serious story that doesn't make you feel like taking a shower afterwards.
    Yeah. That's definitely what I want (Hm... when I wrote this, I realised it could be read as sarcastic. No! I mean it!)

    Sounds like you agree with Phil, too. If so, please tell him!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Eberly View Post
    Toad has been out of character since the original X-Men movie came out in 2000.
    Yep. Then again, that was basically Spider-Man playing him in the movie anyway.

    - Le Messor
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  13. #28

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    I wonder if Wildchild (Or Sasquatch for that matter) might be a part of Sabretooth Reborn:
    http://www.newsarama.com/comics/c2e2...ooth-loeb.html
    http://www.comicvine.com/news/c2e2-j...ebirth/144565/
    Last edited by Phil; 04-16-2012 at 08:30 AM.

  14. #29

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    I would assume Wild Child, but I hope Sasquatch doesn't. There was really no reason for him to be in that last Loeb story...lupine? Bah!

  15. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by -K-M- View Post
    I would assume Wild Child, but I hope Sasquatch doesn't. There was really no reason for him to be in that last Loeb story...lupine? Bah!
    Agreed.
    Support Artists, Not Companies! Creator-owned comics are where the real art is at!

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