Mantlo Inconsistencies

[Flightpath07]

rather than being forced to do the soul in Smart Alec, to Box, to Snowbird's body, as woman, then back to a man....

...which set the bar really high for other writers to take other Alphans and screw up their back story so as to be as unrecognizable as Sas's had just become. I mean, really, Alpha Flight gets treated way worse than Doom Patrol even, think about the back-stories (nowadays) of Mac, Heather, Puck, Sasquatch, Snowbird...like, seriously?!

So very, very frustrating, what was done to those characters. All of them, so very ill-treated.

When I think about it, it is no wonder that AF doesn't have a series right now. Seriously, without a complete reboot, a la New 52 by DC, how could anybody write these characters and expect anybody but a diehard fan to follow them! Too much confusion. Such a shame.

[Jason Eberly]

...which set the bar really high for other writers to take other Alphans and screw up their back story so as to be as unrecognizable as Sas's had just become.

How is Sasquatch's backstory unrecognizable. He's still a scientist who, in an attempt to duplicate Bruce Banner's creation of the Hulk under controlled circumstances, merged with a mystical beast and now turns into a big orange powerhouse named Sasquatch! That's all totally true today. All the stuff that happened in between? It doesn't need to ever be referenced if the writers don't want to. It doesn't mean that all that stuff (for good or ill) never happened, merely that it hasn't changed the origin or current status of the character.

I mean, really, Alpha Flight gets treated way worse than Doom Patrol even, think about the back-stories (nowadays) of Mac, Heather, Puck, Sasquatch, Snowbird...like, seriously?!

While I think Doom Patrol gets more respect than Alpha Flight, they both get treated pretty badly. Of those Alphans you listed, the only ones I think who really differs from their "classic" incarnation are Puck and Heather (of the current group). The rest, though...if you hadn't read a story about Snowbird since, say, the Byrne run, what would you need to be explained to be able to understand her status as of today (or of her last appearance...the last mini?)? Absolutely nothing.

When I think about it, it is no wonder that AF doesn't have a series right now. Seriously, without a complete reboot, a la New 52 by DC, how could anybody write these characters and expect anybody but a diehard fan to follow them! Too much confusion. Such a shame.

If convoluted histories were a major factor in the sales of comic books, the X-Men franchise would not have been popular since about 1986 (when it was revealed that the Jean Grey that died on the moon wasn't really Jean Grey, but a cosmic energy being that copied her form and--ANEURYSM!).

Again, I don't think the Alphans are that confusing. Try explaining Cable to someone. There is so much convolution in his basic backstory that it would probably take charts and timelines to be able to explain it. But explaining Snowbird? "She's the daughter of the Northern Goddess Nelvanna and a human tasked with protecting the Earth from the Great Beasts, her mother's family's ancient enemies. She can change her form to any animal native to Canada." Really...what more do you need to know?

I think Pak and Van Lente did a spectacular job of essentially "jettisoning" all but the basic concepts of these characters with the last mini (with some exceptions, like Puck being in Hell or that the Hudson's had a child).

And I don't believe any character, no matter how contradictory or convoluted, can't be at least seamed together into a cohesive whole by a writer willing to do so (and who has the talent). Geoff Johns did this with Hawkman wonderfully (in my opinion).

[Phil]

if you hadn't read a story about Snowbird since, say, the Byrne run, what would you need to be explained to be able to understand her status as of today (or of her last appearance...the last mini?)? Absolutely nothing.

She can now leave Canada.

Other than that I completely agree with all your other points.

[DIGGER]

[QUOTE=Phil;93557]She can now leave Canada.

Her passport finally came though?!

[Le Messor]

rather than being forced to do the soul in Smart Alec, to Box, to Snowbird's body, as woman, then back to a man....

Technically, nobody was forced to do that; there were many other options. Including leaving Sasquatch dead.

Of course, part of the problem I've had with non-Byrne Alpha is that most of the artists draw him in particular as if they'd never even looked at Byrne's design; and I really like Byrne's design. It's so unique and well-defined.

how could anybody write these characters and expect anybody but a diehard fan to follow them!

But there are plenty of Die Hard fans in the world! Why do else you think they made so many of the movies?

if you hadn't read a story about Snowbird since, say, the Byrne run, what would you need to be explained to be able to understand her status as of today (or of her last appearance...the last mini?)? Absolutely nothing.

I'll second Phil on all this but:

I think Pak and Van Lente did a spectacular job of essentially "jettisoning" all but the basic concepts of these characters with the last mini (with some exceptions, like Puck being in Hell or that the Hudson's had a child).

And a major one - whatever the crap they did to Marrina. She was a polar opposite of her original character.

~ Le Messor
"Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines."